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Slicy

Final Itemization Update for pvp gear

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On January 5th an official announcement has been made concerning the final update for PvP gear : https://forum.elysium-project.org/topic/30420-elysium-pvp-—-itemization-update/

"Final PVP Update

The final PVP update will be 2 weeks after the release of the Ahn’Qiraj launch for all realms.

The stat updates for the Nostalrius PVP realm will not be reverted."

This decision was in line with the specific itemization choices that were made, kept and confirmed for Anathema/Nost PvP which aim at balancing PvP and PvE gear in the best possible way.

We are now over 2 weeks after 1.9 has been added to Anathema. We have yet to be precised if "2 weeks" meant 2 weeks after addition of 1.9 or 2 weeks after AQ actually being opened.

Currently Anathema has the last update (understand final stage of stats) on PvP armor pieces and weapons (which is on par with currently available item drops from raid content) but is missing the last 6 few weapons (1 hand healing, fast melee weapons, etc.) for each faction.

For both PvP and PvE purposes, a lot of the current rank 14 items are on par/slightly better/outclassed by common raid drops (especially healer and caster weapons). This is the reason it was decided to add the complete final pvp itemization update (including the few more weapon choices) with/during 1.9.

Therefore the "final PVP update" mentioned in the topic should include the last few rank 14 weapon choices (none of them have relevant impacts/unfair advantages compared to raid drops and this is concerning 0.001% of the player base).

If that decision is not being respected, you might as well act accordingly by nerfing the PvP armor pieces and weapons back to their previous state which means reverting what has been set in stone by the announcement linked above. It is completely illogical to give advantages to players who went/going r10/12/13 but punish those who pushed/push higher.

It also doesn't make any sense to have an incomplete final pvp update. You either finish and add it entirely or you officially state the reasons why you are not doing it. There is no compromise that would make any sense for this case. You either get the full last pvp itemization update as decided and planned, or you revert it entirely.

The recent debacle with pvp items getting removed from players' inventories, random nerfs on stats etc. has shown these things matter for the player base on Anathema.

This is the exact same issue as what has been recently decided concerning Thunderfury's proc rate : to make the weapon usable and worthy of how hard it is to get while not being too overpowered. Like the final PvP itemization update or the BG queue system, this has been thought over countless times by several different staff of 2 different projects with inputs from players concerned or not about it and the least worst options were identified and you stated you would stick to it.

Currently available rank 14 weapons, even with last stage when it comes to their stats, are WORSE than available raid drops for nearly every class (there is 1 class fully benefitting from it at the moment). The last 6 weapons are just making it fair game for the very few remaining High Warlords and Grand Marshals on the server compared to what every raiding guild is farming since over a year now. It is also a necessity when it comes to letting these players have different options when it comes to what to use in PvP and PvE (which is the sole purpose of what this last pvp gear update actually intended to bring to the game).

If you need any explanations regarding these items compared to raid drops in 40 and 20 man available since over a year (like not giving rank 14 casters and healers the options to use a 1 hander - hello Skull of Impending Doom - over a 2 hander ; or why a rank 14 rogue is forced to use a 2.90 as offhand for PvE - which is garbo for obvious reasons - or a 2.00 dagger for PvP while MC/BWL drop a faster one(s) with on par stats) on a server where players min max both PvP and PvE, I will gladly do it.

A list of the few item IDs to be added to those 2 faction NPCs can also be provided if it would help.

There is a reason why Blizzard added these weapons*. They were meant to fill gaps in the rank 14 rewards to better fit the different classes and specs play styles once they started to understand the game and how it is being played (same argument as to why we play with 1.12 talents here : it's quite bad before that). You already have last version of stats on every piece of pvp armor and weapon. Why prevent Grand Marshals and High Warlords from having more versatility in what should be available to them to play properly ?

* "New rank 14 weapons have been added! In order to give casters the same diversity of selection that melee currently enjoy we have added new caster items that are available to be purchased by Grand Marshals and High Warlords." This is the entire point of the pvp itemization update.

How is that gonna have a negative impact on the server when it barely concerns 84 remaining active rank 14 who are those who spent most time in there. For all I know it would, at most, incite very few more players to go for ranks, which is anything but a bad consequence.

Not only the item power between rank 14 weapons and currently available raid drops are on par at most, but not adding the last weapons would drag down the ranking scene even more.

**If the top end rewards of ranking do not keep up with raiding drops, there will be less and less rankers which in the end is gonna entirely kill Battlegrounds participation. Casters and Healers already had very few incentive to go for maximum rank. The last weapons added rather sooner than never would revitalize the currently dying ranking and BG scene on Anathema. When you have no ranking scene, BGs don't pop at anytime of the day or night. With that in mind, when non rankers queue for a BG, if they get a 2 hours queue time, they will just go do something else and/or get back to raid logging. No ranking scene > No more active BG action > PvP dead. Especially when the RP calculation issues are still around, which are being brought up by 3-4 rankers (for the most part gave up because of it) every single week since 2 months.

** = Yet another reason why it has been decided to add these few items during 1.9 and not during 1.11, twice, by 2 different projects and several dev teams.

There is a limit to pvp oriented players' resiliency (pun intended). Let's not find it out.

 

Edited by Slicy

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22 minutes ago, Slicy said:

On January 5th an official announcement has been made concerning the final update for PvP gear : https://forum.elysium-project.org/topic/30420-elysium-pvp-—-itemization-update/

"Final PVP Update

The final PVP update will be 2 weeks after the release of the Ahn’Qiraj launch for all realms.

The stat updates for the Nostalrius PVP realm will not be reverted."

 

This decision was in line with the specific itemization choices that were made, kept and confirmed for Anathema/Nost PvP which aim at balancing PvP and PvE gear in the best possible way.

We are now over 2 weeks after 1.9 has been added to Anathema. We have yet to be precised if "2 weeks" meant 2 weeks after addition of 1.9 or 2 weeks after AQ actually being opened.

Currently Anathema has the last update (understand final stage of stats) on PvP armor pieces and weapons (which is on par with currently available item drops from raid content) but is missing the last 6 few weapons (1 hand healing, fast melee weapons, etc.) for each faction.

For both PvP and PvE purposes, a lot of the current rank 14 items are on par/slightly better/outclassed by common raid drops (especially healer and caster weapons). This is the reason it was decided to add the complete final pvp itemization update (including the few more weapon choices) with/during 1.9.

Therefore the "final PVP update" mentioned in the topic should include the last few rank 14 weapon choices (none of them have relevant impacts/unfair advantages compared to raid drops and this is concerning 0.001% of the player base).

If that decision is not being respected, you might as well act accordingly by nerfing the PvP armor pieces and weapons back to their previous state which means reverting what has been set in stone by the announcement linked above. It is completely illogical to give advantages to players who went/going r10/12/13 but punish those who pushed/push higher.

It also doesn't make any sense to have an incomplete final pvp update. You either finish and add it entirely or you officially state the reasons why you are not doing it. There is no compromise that would make any sense for this case. You either get the full last pvp itemization update as decided and planned, or you revert it entirely.

The recent debacle with pvp items getting removed from players' inventories, random nerfs on stats etc. has shown these things matter for the player base on Anathema.

This is the exact same issue as what has been recently decided concerning Thunderfury to make the weapon usable and worthy of how hard it is to get while not being too overpowered.

 

 

 

Yeah what is this shit. Staff always half ass what they do, and never commit to he things they say they will do. This is as simple as adding some items into the game. You guys said "final pvp update", entailing there would be no further updates. Does that mean you aren't adding the weapons in at all??

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Quote

This decision is final.

Final as in final for the week?

"Hmm, what procrate should we put on TF this week?"

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29 минут назад, notmecher сказал:

>This decision is final

fd84662f708d969fb98a4fec641c2107.jpg

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1 hour ago, Slicy said:

On January 5th an official announcement has been made concerning the final update for PvP gear : https://forum.elysium-project.org/topic/30420-elysium-pvp-—-itemization-update/

"Final PVP Update

The final PVP update will be 2 weeks after the release of the Ahn’Qiraj launch for all realms.

The stat updates for the Nostalrius PVP realm will not be reverted."

 

This decision was in line with the specific itemization choices that were made, kept and confirmed for Anathema/Nost PvP which aim at balancing PvP and PvE gear in the best possible way.

We are now over 2 weeks after 1.9 has been added to Anathema. We have yet to be precised if "2 weeks" meant 2 weeks after addition of 1.9 or 2 weeks after AQ actually being opened.

Currently Anathema has the last update (understand final stage of stats) on PvP armor pieces and weapons (which is on par with currently available item drops from raid content) but is missing the last 6 few weapons (1 hand healing, fast melee weapons, etc.) for each faction.

For both PvP and PvE purposes, a lot of the current rank 14 items are on par/slightly better/outclassed by common raid drops (especially healer and caster weapons). This is the reason it was decided to add the complete final pvp itemization update (including the few more weapon choices) with/during 1.9.

Therefore the "final PVP update" mentioned in the topic should include the last few rank 14 weapon choices (none of them have relevant impacts/unfair advantages compared to raid drops and this is concerning 0.001% of the player base).

If that decision is not being respected, you might as well act accordingly by nerfing the PvP armor pieces and weapons back to their previous state which means reverting what has been set in stone by the announcement linked above. It is completely illogical to give advantages to players who went/going r10/12/13 but punish those who pushed/push higher.

It also doesn't make any sense to have an incomplete final pvp update. You either finish and add it entirely or you officially state the reasons why you are not doing it. There is no compromise that would make any sense for this case. You either get the full last pvp itemization update as decided and planned, or you revert it entirely.

The recent debacle with pvp items getting removed from players' inventories, random nerfs on stats etc. has shown these things matter for the player base on Anathema.

This is the exact same issue as what has been recently decided concerning Thunderfury to make the weapon usable and worthy of how hard it is to get while not being too overpowered.

Currently available rank 14 weapons, even with last stage when it comes to their stats, are WORSE than available raid drops for nearly every class. The last 6 weapons are just making it fair game for the very few remaining High Warlords and Grand Marshals on the server compared to what every raiding guild is farming since over a year now.

Not only this is disregarding the actual item powers between rank 14 weapons and currently available raid drops, but not adding the last weapons would drag down the ranking scene even more.

If the top end rewards of ranking are not on par with raiding drops, there will be less and less rankers which in the end is gonna entirely kill Battlegrounds participation. Casters and Healers already had very few incentive to go for maximum rank. The last weapons added rather sooner than never would revitalize the currently dying ranking and BG scene on Anathema.


 

 

 

+1

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Talking about itemization changes.. Thunderfury is broken again even after staff changing it recently. 

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The question that follows after is will Elysium always allow weapon/armor purchases based on highest attained rank? I think they should.

 

Patch 1.7 removed PvP purchases based on highest attained rank. It was a mistake on Blizzard's part. Elysium seeks to recreate vanilla, but Blizzard couldn't predict their own future. Here we know the honor system was revamped in TBC and Naxx was the end of Vanilla. NOT following 1.7 PvP changes to the letter will allow the previous R14s to purchase the weapons only available in 1.11, a huge improvement over Blizzard's decision to revert purchases based on highest attained rank.

Edited by Spaztick

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This has already been discussed in the past. There should be a minimum current pvp rank to enter Champion's Hall and its horde counterpart I believe and I don't think it is the case at the moment.

Elysium project does not seek to recreate the history of vanilla to a 100% extent (trust me you really don't want that). Else we would be rocking dogshit talent trees and other kind of blizzlike shenanigans which are nothing but real pain to implement and absolutely awful to play with. Population would be garbo (and they probably wouldn't even do it considering how the tasks at hands are way enough workload already it seems). You wouldn't even bother playing here without the non blizzlike dynamic respawn timer mechanic.

Anathema/Nost PvP isn't a fresh server. Things were discussed, designed and decided for it with very good reasons by both Nost staff and later Elysium staff. Players were aware of these decisions, took part in the discussions and that's what matters here. Anathema player base got told and confirmed several times a balance would be kept between gear obtained with PvP ranks and the one obtained with PvE. Not sticking to that decision essentially is backstabbing the few remaining players who actually cared about these things and sticked around (despite being cucked during the last itemization debacle).

This thread isn't about the fresh servers or the yet again bugged Thunderfury proc. It's a suggestion / request for an official answer about what is going to be done or not for the final pvp update on Anathema, in relation to what has been said at server relaunch, been announced January 5th and confirmed several times after that.

Sticking to the plan and showing consistency in decisions being made about such game related topics is what make a player base/community stay around and end up in a successful project or not.

Edited by Slicy

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+1

It's not like these items are overpowered or anything compared to current loot from BWL etc it just provides more options. And the healing mace would be a much bigger incentive for healers to actually go r14.

In the end all it does is provide your players who has put in the most hours a few cosmetic options to show off in Ironforge/Org :)

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8 hours ago, Wrath said:

+1

It's not like these items are overpowered or anything compared to current loot from BWL etc it just provides more options. And the healing mace would be a much bigger incentive for healers to actually go r14.

In the end all it does is provide your players who has put in the most hours a few cosmetic options to show off in Ironforge/Org :)

The stat allocation makes it more appropriate for PvP. The weapons are competitive for raiding, but it is the pinnacle of the ranking system. Going back to how we can predict the future (because Blizzard made all of Vanilla already) I see no reason not to push 1.11 changes to live, which includes the caster PvP weapons and the buffed gear.

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The buffed gear (armors and weapons) is already there. Applying the last pvp gear itemization update to Anathema has already been decided and applied but not entirely for no official reasons.

As you can read in the official patch notes, these weapons were added to provide more diversity. It is fixing ranking rewards at the maximum rank being lackluster in terms of options and regarding classes and specs gameplay.

In a sense if you don't want them before 1.11, you might as well be honest about it and request for talents to be as they were during 1.9.

Ranking scene is dying. No rankers > No BGs > Dead PvP activity on the server. If you can't fix the RP calculation issues, you might as well ensure that all the ranking rewards are added to the game so that the more resilient players get an incentive at queuing for Battlegrounds.

The thread simply explains the reasons why, outlines the fact few weapons are missing from that final itemization update and asks for a confirmation on when will the last part of it will be added (which is a question asked since 2 months already).

 

Edited by Slicy

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Dumping and adding another question :

Who is in charge of making sure content addition is being consistent here ?

Why would you add what you said wouldn't be added until the gates open (aka badges quests and gear rewards) but you don't add/finish what you said would be added (final pvp itemization update) ?

Edited by Slicy

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Yeah sure let's fuck the 80 remaining rank 14 who have spent more time than the rest in here, not stick to what has been decided and keep being inconsistent as to what to add as content and when, I guess.

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Apologies for bumping an old thread but we're still waiting for this update.

We hoped it was 2 weeks after the war effort, when that passed we hoped it was 2 weeks after the scepter quest was added; again it wasn't.  Now we're 3 weeks post the raid instance being open and still no updated weapons.

Guilds are assigning loot based on these weapons being added when they were promised.  Rank 14 players are currently at the back of the queue for femurs and C'thun maces, it's a negative to be an ex rank 14 right now.

I know we're a minority of the player base and the devs are busy but please can we get some info on this.

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8 hours ago, Ratty said:

Apologies for bumping an old thread but we're still waiting for this update.

We hoped it was 2 weeks after the war effort, when that passed we hoped it was 2 weeks after the scepter quest was added; again it wasn't.  Now we're 3 weeks post the raid instance being open and still no updated weapons.

Guilds are assigning loot based on these weapons being added when they were promised.  Rank 14 players are currently at the back of the queue for femurs and C'thun maces, it's a negative to be an ex rank 14 right now.

I know we're a minority of the player base and the devs are busy but please can we get some info on this.

+1

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On 17.5.2017 at 5:20 AM, Ratty said:

Apologies for bumping an old thread but we're still waiting for this update.

We hoped it was 2 weeks after the war effort, when that passed we hoped it was 2 weeks after the scepter quest was added; again it wasn't.  Now we're 3 weeks post the raid instance being open and still no updated weapons.

Guilds are assigning loot based on these weapons being added when they were promised.  Rank 14 players are currently at the back of the queue for femurs and C'thun maces, it's a negative to be an ex rank 14 right now.

I know we're a minority of the player base and the devs are busy but please can we get some info on this.

+2

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