Leigh

I'm not crying, I'm stating a fact, and if you look back through the previous 8 pages you will see this is a common complaint among players. Yes, players who put in more time and effort are rewarded (I don't think creating a premade requires the mass of time/effort you seem to think it does) but we are talking about encouraging greater pvp participation, which I have said is hindered by unfairness in premades stomping pugs into graveyard submission. No one enjoys that. Not even the premade. I never did, it was just the best way to grind honor. I'm not addressing your comparison because it's a ridiculous comparison; if 40 people in an MC raid directly impacted the enjoyment of another 40 people in their MC raid, it would be a valid comparison, but it doesn't. Hence why you don't see people complaining about premade.. raids..? Anyway, I'm not arguing with this brick wall anymore. I'll let the other 8 pages of complaints speak for themselves.

>Why should you get a level playing field ^ This said it all right here ^ You have to be warped to think there is no issue in a system where it is pitting people with voice-chat, gear, proper group composition against a group of randoms with none of that and calling it fair play. I know exactly what is required, I play in premades like I said, all I'm doing this WSG weekend is running prems. It's still a ridiculous system and I can easily see the frustration people have. I'm not even going to comment on your last scenario because it's an absurd comparison. We are talking about the enjoyment of PvP and how to encourage greater participation. I can assure you PuG's being stomped into graveyard submission is large part of the problem.

>Which is exactly what you are trying to get by disabling premades. It's amazing how blind to your own hypocrisy you guys are. "People shouldn't be allowed to queue in groups because they get easy wins and good honor, and the easy wins and good honor should go to ME and not THEM." It's laughable. Wtf are you even talking about? How is disabling premades asking for easy wins and good honor. I'm asking for a level playing field, PuG vs PuG > Prem vs Prem. There is no hypocrisy at all? I get good honor anyway. I play in premades (here and back on K2) I still don't like the way it works, it's not a fair playing field whatsoever and it's why many casual players aren't participating imo.

I can tell you on Elysium, I see none ever. So you're experience and mine are vastly different.

Wrong, wrong and wrong. These 'dedicated pvp'ers' are only in premades because they provide easy wins and quick honor for the gear you say they don't want. How many rank 13's/14's do you see in bgs pvping? Next to none. Why? Because they have the gear and they're done. They aren't joining premades for the competition, they're doing it because its free easy honor without any challenge, and when they have the easily acquired gear, they stop. And if what you say is true, there should be a seperate queue for those who want to premade and those who want to pug? If these dedicated pvpers do so want that hardcore competition you speak of, that should work fine. My bet is that no one will premade anymore, because they want easy honor, not challenging games that are dragged out and take an hour or more.

Appreciate the work, but you still haven't fixed fear and death coil causing players to warp all over the freaking place :'( It is a major problem.

You are clearly not playing on Elysium, or perhaps (still unlikely) playing Alliance on Elysium, but I can tell you last night I ran about 10 AB bg's all but 1 were premade. Of course, this does depend what time of week you queue, later in the week is usual better. Your argument that people are being 'outplayed' and 'laying blame' is utter rubbish, it's obvious when you are up against a premade.. they are the same set of people you deal with every day. "played 100's of bg's" rofl.. not a chance if you see 10% as being premade - Sincerely, Rank 11 UD Warlock with 20,000hk's on Elysium horde

The release of AV won't change anything. Player's will go to whatever gives the most honor, which will only be AV on its weekend, outside of that it will continue to be AB premades stomping pugs.

Just for the record, if you made it so that premades only vsed other premades, they wouldn't premade at all. They aren't doing it for competition, they're doing it for easy, free, without challenge honor farming. That's it.

My suggestions; 1. Disallow raid group queuing, limit it to party queues. This will encourage involvement and be more entertaining for all involved. Most premades are dull to be apart of as you just stomp the opposition and then afk, and those players on the opposite side are mostly afk from the beginning. People also always bring up the "Why don't you make your own premade", well we have numerous times, but Alliance controls the queue and I find if we create a premade in WSG for instance and beat the Alliance prem, they just stop queuing and go to AB and the cycle continues. They don't want competition. They want free honor. I've even had two different Alliance AB prems just let us win because we weren't worth their time which proves this point. Mind you, it's also much more irritating to form a premade on horde side because the queues are so long, often people don't want to give up their queue to be apart of the premade. (which is made worse by Alliance switching as soon as they lose, making queue intolerably long) I am of course speaking of Elysium.