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Nasha

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About Nasha

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  1. So I recently noticed that Wow-One forums went down and many guides disappeared with it. I saved one which I was particularly fond of which was a repost of a guide on hunter rotation originally from Elitist Jerks. This dude spent many hours testing different ranged weapons against actual raids. So I'm gonna repost it here so it can be saved for future use. Highlights of the post: Explaining hunter rotation Showing damage numbers for full and clipped cycles for every weapon Bloodseeker does almost the same damage as Rhok'Delar if you don't go oom And here for the repost: =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Main post =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= BASIC THEORY Using Aimed + Multi-Shot cycle Multi-Shot is instant (close enough to the truth, very rarely delays Auto Shot with practice) Disregarding mana, consumables negate mana issues Disregarding haste buffs (Rapid Fire, Berserking, etc) With 5/5 Improved Aspect of the Hawk, I add 4-5% damage, depending on weapon speed - Note: Working on better formula for iAotH Every cycle consists roughly of: 1 Aimed Shot 1 Multi-Shot x Auto Shot, depending on weapon speed and cycle lenght. With most weapons, you'll find something like the following happening: Aimed Shot finishes cooldown. Auto Shot fired ~1 sec ago. Should you clip your cycle (ignore the next Auto Shot and fire Aimed Shot immediately)? Or should you use a full cycle (wait for the Auto Shot before using Aimed Shot? What would give the highest damage potential? To answer this, you needed to compare both options, and see which one would yield the most damage. THE AIMED SHOT CYCLE Multi-Shot has the longest cooldown (10 sec), but since we stated Multi-Shot is an instant, the damage can be converted into any cycle lenght. For this reason, I'll be using a default (clipped) cycle length of 9 seconds. While not being optimal for mana purposes, it is the one with the highest damage potential. This is roughly what you'll have to take into account: If Multi-Shot does 1000 damage every 10 seconds, and the cycle is 5 seconds, the cycle damage for Multi-Shot becomes 500. Likewise, if the cycle lenght is 20 seconds, the cycle damage would be 2000. However, there are some things to keep in mind as well: If the cycle is between 9 (minimum cycle length) and 10 seconds long, you have to include damage lost by conflicting cooldowns. For example, in a perfect 9 second cycle, you get to fire 6 Multi-Shots every 7 cycles. So, instead of using 9/10 of the Multi-Shot, I use 6/7 for this. As cycle lenght reaches 10, more of the Multi-Shot damage is included. So, don't be alarmed if you're not able to fire a Multi-Shot between each Aimed Shot. The cooldown of Aimed Shot is 6 seconds, casting time is 3 seconds. During casting, Auto Shot cools down. This means that basically every weapon will get a free Auto Shot after Aimed Shot. The free Auto Shot comes after a delay of about 0.5 seconds after Aimed Shot is fired, regardless of weapon speed. During the casting of Aimed Shot, no Auto Shots are fired. Stats on weapons that affect damage (Agility, (Ranged) Attack Power, +crit%, +hit%) are taken into consideration for the rankings. For the timestamps, I won't include Multi-Shot. Every cycle basically has a "+ Multi-Shot", which can be placed wherever it fits before Aimed Shot. MISCONCEPTIONS Cycles don't exist Arcane Shot and Aimed Shot have a linked cooldown. For raiding purposes, Aimed Shot is better than Arcane Shot in virtually every aspect. Although there are some exceptions, Aimed Shot is the best option for dealing ranged damage. Every time you use Aimed Shot, you've started a cycle. After Aimed Shot is completed, you have 6 seconds before Aimed Shot is ready again. Go clipped or full? Cycles are impossible to use They're not. Performing them perfectly is practically impossible, and it's harder with some weapons. However, getting as close as possible will be the most damaging thing you can do. Thus, the calculations I give you show the weapon with highest damage potential, and also how to deal the most damage with it. It's up to you to maximize the potential. Practice, focus, and knowing the rhythm of your weapon helps a lot; you're always able to improve. Additionally, a timer for your Auto Shots might help you a lot. Personally, I use ZHunterMod (http://curse-gaming.com/en/wow/addons-3592-1-zhuntermod.html). Clipped cycles are the easiest to use, since you can basically spam Aimed Shot and Multi-Shot, and the cooldowns will take care of the rest. Remember that latency might affect this a bit, making Aimed Shot ready just before Auto Shot fires (making you do a sub-optimal cycle). Spamming is rarely a good idea; paying attention is ;) Lag and human reaction invalidate cycle calculations Often you'll hear people claiming cycles are useless because of reasons like lag, human reaction, etc. These settings vary from person to person; hunter A might have perfect conditions, performing at almost 100% of what he's capable of, while hunter B might be experiencing lag, talking on the phone and feeding his parrot - of course he'll perform worse. However, comparing the different weapons, using optimal conditions for everything is the fairest comparison. Although this has no influence on a weapon's damage potential, if you know you suffer from lag or slow reaction times, take it into consideration when looking at what I write. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Weapons and formulae =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= LIST OF WEAPONS This is the current list of weapons I've compared: Ancient Bone Bow Ashjre'thul Blastershot Launcher Blessed Qiraji Musket Bloodseeker Bow of Taut Sinew Bow of the Four Horsemen Carapace Spine Crossbow Core Marksman Rifle Crossbow of Imminent Doom Dragonbreath Hand Cannon Fahrad's Reloading Repeater Flawless Arcanite Rifle Grand Marshal's Bullseye / High Warlord's Recurve Grand Marshal's Hand Cannon / High Warlord's Street Sweeper Grand Marshal's Repeater / High Warlord's Crossbow Gryphonwing Long Bow Gurubashi Dwarf Destroyer Heartstriker Hoodoo Hunting Bow Huhuran's Stinger Larvae of the Great Worm Mandokir's Sting Nerubian Slavemaker Rhok'delar Silithid Husked Launcher Stoneshatter Striker's Mark Toxin Injector Weapons will be listed sorted by damage potential; highest = first. All values listed are vs bosses (level 63 mobs --> 8.6% missrate), and before armor mitigation. This is how the information is going to be shown: 1 - The Milk Makerâ„¢, 2.0 speed Best cycle DPS: 657, Clipped Worst cycle DPS: 649, Full Auto Shot DPS: 419 (1st) Auto Shot DPS is included mostly for mana reasons. If two weapons seem very equal, but you know you run out of mana alot, you might want to choose the one with highest Auto Shot DPS, even though it could have a slightly lower best cycle. Auto Shot DPS is the DPS a weapon would have using only Auto Shot, not Aimed Shot or Multi-Shot. Auto Shot DPS might work as a tool for selecting a weapon for encounters where you feel you can't use standard cycles. (1st) indicates the ranking of Auto Shot DPS. If it's the best Auto Shot DPS weapon, it'll be (1st), second best would be (2nd), etc. Note that using average cycle DPS is not a good idea for comparing weapons. For example, if you know the best cycle for The Milk Makerâ„¢ is clipped, you wouldn't make half your cycles full; you would try to use the best cycle whenever possible. A full cycle is, in most cases, slightly harder to perform than a clipped one, since you can't just spam the button and let the cooldowns take care of the rest. WEAPONS TO COME Dwarven Hand Cannon Polished Ironwood Crossbow If you want any more weapons added, let me know, and I'll see what I can do. Alternatively, you can use your own gear / setup, and compare weapons, etc directly by using my spreadsheet: http://forums.elitistjerks.com/viewtopic.php?id=7312 FORMULAE USED Auto Shot damage: SlayingMod*(AmmoDPS*WeaponSpeed+RWSMod*(RAP/14*WeaponSpeed+Scope+AverageWeaponDamage)) Aimed Shot damage: SlayingMod*(AmmoDPS*WeaponSpeed+RWSMod*(RAP/14*2.8+Scope+AverageWeaponDamage+AimedShotBonus)) Multi-Shot damage: BarrageMod*GSMod*SlayingMod*MSCoEff* (AmmoDPS*WeaponSpeed+RWSMod*(RAP/14*2.8+Scope+AverageWeaponDamage+MultiShotBonus)) CritDamage (all shots): HitDamage*(2+MortalShotsMod)*SlayingMod Factoring in crits (all shots): HitChance*HitDamage + CritChance*Critdamage AimedShotBonus = 600 MultiShotBonus = 150 MortalShotsMod = 0.30 SlayingMod = 1.03 if Slaying Talent, 1 if not RWSMod = 1.05 if MM spec, 1 if LR spec BarrageMod = 1.15 if MM spec, 1 if LR spec GSMod = 1.15 if 8/8 Giantstalker bonus, 1 if not MSCoEff: Coefficient for Multi-Shot. Since the cooldown of Multi-Shot is 10 seconds, it's obvious that using cycles between 9 and 10 seconds will make you lose a Multi-Shot now and again. For example, using a 9 second cycle, due to the conflicting cooldowns of Multi-Shot and Aimed Shot, you'll be able to fire about 6 Multi-Shots every 7 cycles. So, for 9 second cycles, I add 6/7 of the Multi-Shot damage listed. As the cycle lenght reaches 10 seconds, more of the Multi-Shot damage is used. MSCoEff = ROUNDDOWN(6/(10-CycleTime)) / ROUNDDOWN(1+6/(10-CycleTime))) for cycles not exceeding 10 seconds, 1 for cycles exceeding 10 seconds. CONTACT INFORMATION Talnivarr EU - Horde -- Lactose or Label If there's anything you want to comment, ask, etc, feel free to log on and send me a whisper. Please respect if I'm busy though =) I also check this forum frequently, so posting here or sending a PM should work as well ;) =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Tier 2+ MM-hunter =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= The following is aimed at a hunter with good equipment, roughly equivalent to full tier 2 or better. SETUP 1500 RAP 23.5% ranged crit +8% hit 5/5 Improved Aspect of the Hawk 3/3 Barrage 5/5 Mortal Shots 5/5 Ranged Weapon Specialization 3/3 Slaying vs Target +7 scope 15% quiver Thorium ammo (17.5 DPS) Link to example gear setup: http://ctprofiles.net/3044976 WEAPONS RANKING All values listed are vs bosses (level 63 mobs --> 8.6% missrate), and before armor mitigation. 1 - Nerubian Slavemaker, 3.2 speed Best cycle DPS: 599, Full Worst cycle DPS: 503, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 304 (1st) 2 - Ashjre'thul, 3.4 speed Best cycle DPS: 571, Full Worst cycle DPS: 491, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 283 (9th) 3 - Larvae of the Great Worm, 3.0 speed Best cycle DPS: 558, Clipped Worst cycle DPS: 530, Full Auto Shot DPS: 290 (3rd) 4 - Soulstring, 2.9 speed Best cycle DPS: 551, Clipped Worst cycle DPS: 534, Full Auto Shot DPS: 293 (2nd) 5 - Crossbow of Imminent Doom, 3.1 speed Best cycle DPS: 547, Clipped Worst cycle DPS: 507, Full Auto Shot DPS: 276 (13th) 6 - Grand Marshal's Hand Cannon & Repeater / High Warlord's Street Sweeper & Crossbow, 2.9 speed Best cycle DPS: 538, Clipped Worst cycle DPS: 521, Full Auto Shot DPS: 285 (8th) 7 - Rhok'delar, 2.9 speed Best cycle DPS: 534, Clipped Worst cycle DPS: 517, Full Auto Shot DPS: 282 (10th) 8 - Fahrad's Reloading Repeater, 3.2 speed Best cycle DPS: 530, Full Worst cycle DPS: 447, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 261 (22nd) 9 - Bloodseeker, 3.3 speed Best cycle DPS: 528, Full Worst cycle DPS: 451, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 259 (23th) 10 - Huhuran's Stinger, 2.7 speed Best cycle DPS: 525, Full Worst cycle DPS: 517, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 286 (6th) 11 - Blessed Qiraji Musket, 2.6 speed Best cycle DPS: 525, Full Worst cycle DPS: 506, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 286 (6th) 12 - Carapace Spine Crossbow, 3.3 speed Best cycle DPS: 523, Full Worst cycle DPS: 447, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 257 (26th) 13 - Dragonbreath Hand Cannon, 2.8 speed Best cycle DPS: 521, Clipped Worst cycle DPS: 516, Full Auto Shot DPS: 281 (11th) 14 - Heartstriker, 2.6 speed Best cycle DPS: 516, Full Worst cycle DPS: 498, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 280 (12th) 15 - Flawless Arcanite Rifle, 3.0 speed Best cycle DPS: 510, Clipped Worst cycle DPS: 482, Full Auto Shot DPS: 233 (28th) 16 - Striker's Mark, 2.5 speed Best cycle DPS: 509, Full Worst cycle DPS: 480, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 274 (14th) 17 - Gurubashi Dwarf Destroyer, 2.8 speed Best cycle DPS: 508, Clipped Worst cycle DPS: 503, Full Auto Shot DPS: 272 (16th) 18 - Blastershot Launcher, 2.6 speed Best cycle DPS: 508, Full Worst cycle DPS: 491, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 274 (14th) 19 - Toxin Injector, 2.0 speed Best cycle DPS: 503, Clipped Worst cycle DPS: 498, Full Auto Shot DPS: 290 (3rd) 20 - Core Marksman Rifle, 2.5 speed Best cycle DPS: 503, Full Worst cycle DPS: 474, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 270 (18th) 21 - Mandokir's Sting, 2.6 speed Best cycle DPS: 502, Full Worst cycle DPS: 484, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 270 (18th) 22 - Hoodoo Hunting Bow, 2.8 speed Best cycle DPS: 499, Clipped Worst cycle DPS: 493, Full Auto Shot DPS: 265 (20th) 23 - Stoneshatter, 2.9 speed Best cycle DPS: 499, Clipped Worst cycle DPS: 482, Full Auto Shot DPS: 258 (25th) 24 - Silithid Husked Launcher, 2.8 speed Best cycle DPS: 496, Clipped Worst cycle DPS: 490, Full Auto Shot DPS: 263 (21st) 25 - Bow of Taut Sinew, 2.2 speed Best cycle DPS: 496, Full Worst cycle DPS: 445, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 272 (16th) 26 - Grand Marshal's Bullseye / High Warlord's Recurve, 1.8 speed Best cycle DPS: 494, Full Worst cycle DPS: 470, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 287 (5th) 27 - Ancient Bone Bow, 2.8 speed Best cycle DPS: 490, Clipped Worst cycle DPS: 484, Full Auto Shot DPS: 259 (23rd) 28 - Gryphonwing Longbow, 2.7 speed Best cycle DPS: 477, Full Worst cycle DPS: 473, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 254 (27th) =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Tier 2+ LR-hunter =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= The following is aimed at a hunter with good equipment, roughly equivalent to full tier 2 or better. SETUP 1550 RAP 28% ranged crit +9% hit 5/5 Mortal Shots 5/5 Lightning Reflexes 3/3 Slaying vs Target +7 scope 15% quiver Thorium ammo (17.5 DPS) Link to example gear setup: http://ctprofiles.net/3045139 WEAPONS RANKING All values listed are vs bosses (level 63 mobs --> 8.6% missrate), and before armor mitigation. 1 - Nerubian Slavemaker, 3.2 speed Best cycle DPS: 566, Full Worst cycle DPS: 474, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 311 (1st) 2 - Ashjre'thul, 3.4 speed Best cycle DPS: 539, Full Worst cycle DPS: 463, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 291 (9th) 3 - Larvae of the Great Worm, 3.0 speed Best cycle DPS: 528, Clipped Worst cycle DPS: 501, Full Auto Shot DPS: 298 (3rd) 4 - Soulstring, 2.9 speed Best cycle DPS: 521, Clipped Worst cycle DPS: 505, Full Auto Shot DPS: 300 (2nd) 5 - Crossbow of Imminent Doom, 3.1 speed Best cycle DPS: 516, Clipped Worst cycle DPS: 478, Full Auto Shot DPS: 283 (13th) 6 - Grand Marshal's Hand Cannon & Repeater / High Warlord's Street Sweeper & Crossbow, 2.9 speed Best cycle DPS: 509, Clipped Worst cycle DPS: 493, Full Auto Shot DPS: 293 (8th) 7 - Rhok'delar, 2.9 speed Best cycle DPS: 506, Clipped Worst cycle DPS: 490, Full Auto Shot DPS: 289 (10th) 8 - Bloodseeker, 3.3 speed Best cycle DPS: 501, Full Worst cycle DPS: 427, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 267 (23th) 9 - Huhuran's Stinger, 2.7 speed Best cycle DPS: 498, Full Worst cycle DPS: 492, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 294 (6th) 10 - Blessed Qiraji Musket, 2.6 speed Best cycle DPS: 497, Full Worst cycle DPS: 480, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 294 (6th) 11 - Carapace Spine Crossbow, 3.3 speed Best cycle DPS: 497, Full Worst cycle DPS: 424, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 264 (26th) 12 - Fahrad's Reloading Repeater, 3.2 speed Best cycle DPS: 497, Full Worst cycle DPS: 419, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 266 (22nd) 13 - Dragonbreath Hand Cannon, 2.8 speed Best cycle DPS: 495, Clipped Worst cycle DPS: 489, Full Auto Shot DPS: 289 (11th) 14 - Heartstriker, 2.6 speed Best cycle DPS: 489, Full Worst cycle DPS: 472, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 288 (12th) 15 - Gurubashi Dwarf Destroyer, 2.8 speed Best cycle DPS: 482, Clipped Worst cycle DPS: 477, Full Auto Shot DPS: 280 (16th) 16 - Blastershot Launcher, 2.6 speed Best cycle DPS: 482, Full Worst cycle DPS: 466, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 281 (14th) 17 - Striker's Mark, 2.5 speed Best cycle DPS: 481, Full Worst cycle DPS: 454, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 280 (14th) 18 - Flawless Arcanite Rifle, 3.0 speed Best cycle DPS: 480, Clipped Worst cycle DPS: 453, Full Auto Shot DPS: 264 (28th) 19 - Toxin Injector, 2.0 speed Best cycle DPS: 478, Clipped Worst cycle DPS: 473, Full Auto Shot DPS: 298 (3rd) 20 - Mandokir's Sting, 2.6 speed Best cycle DPS: 476, Full Worst cycle DPS: 461, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 278 (18th) 21 - Hoodoo Hunting Bow, 2.8 speed Best cycle DPS: 474, Clipped Worst cycle DPS: 468, Full Auto Shot DPS: 273 (20th) 22 - Core Marksman Rifle, 2.5 speed Best cycle DPS: 474, Full Worst cycle DPS: 448, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 276 (18th) 23 - Stoneshatter, 2.9 speed Best cycle DPS: 472, Clipped Worst cycle DPS: 455, Full Auto Shot DPS: 265 (25th) 24 - Silithid Husked Launcher, 2.8 speed Best cycle DPS: 471, Clipped Worst cycle DPS: 465, Full Auto Shot DPS: 271 (21st) 25 - Bow of Taut Sinew, 2.2 speed Best cycle DPS: 471, Full Worst cycle DPS: 423, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 280 (16th) 26 - Grand Marshal's Bullseye / High Warlord's Recurve, 1.8 speed Best cycle DPS: 469, Full Worst cycle DPS: 448, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 294 (5th) 27 - Ancient Bone Bow, 2.8 speed Best cycle DPS: 466, Clipped Worst cycle DPS: 460, Full Auto Shot DPS: 267 (23rd) 28 - Gryphonwing Longbow, 2.7 speed Best cycle DPS: 454, Full Worst cycle DPS: 450, Clipped Auto Shot DPS: 262 (27th) =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= 15% Cycle Timers =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Speed: 1.5 (Reduced to 1.30 with quiver) Clipped Full 0.50 Free Auto 0.50 Free Auto 1.80 Auto 1.80 Auto 3.11 Auto 3.11 Auto 4.41 Auto 4.41 Auto 5.72 Auto 5.72 Auto 6.00 Start Aimed 7.02 Auto 9.00 Aimed 7.02 Start Aimed 10.02 Aimed Speed: 1.6 (Reduced to 1.39 with quiver) Clipped Full 0.50 Free Auto 0.50 Free Auto 1.89 Auto 1.89 Auto 3.28 Auto 3.28 Auto 4.67 Auto 4.67 Auto 6.00 Start Aimed 6.07 Auto 9.00 Aimed 6.07 Start Aimed 9.07 Aimed Speed: 1.7 (Reduced to 1.48 with quiver) Clipped Full 0.50 Free Auto 0.50 Free Auto 1.98 Auto 1.98 Auto 3.46 Auto 3.46 Auto 4.93 Auto 4.93 Auto 6.00 Start Aimed 6.41 Auto 9.00 Aimed 6.41 Start Aimed 9.41 Aimed Speed: 1.8 (Reduced to 1.57 with quiver) Clipped Full 0.50 Free Auto 0.50 Free Auto 2.07 Auto 2.07 Auto 3.63 Auto 3.63 Auto 5.20 Auto 5.20 Auto 6.00 Start Aimed 6.76 Auto 9.00 Aimed 6.76 Start Aimed 9.76 Aimed Speed: 1.9 (Reduced to 1.65 with quiver) Clipped Full 0.50 Free Auto 0.50 Free Auto 2.15 Auto 2.15 Auto 3.80 Auto 3.80 Auto 5.46 Auto 5.46 Auto 6.00 Start Aimed 7.11 Auto 9.00 Aimed 7.11 Start Aimed 10.11 Aimed Speed: 2.0 (Reduced to 1.74 with quiver) Clipped Full 0.50 Free Auto 0.50 Free Auto 2.24 Auto 2.24 Auto 3.98 Auto 3.98 Auto 5.72 Auto 5.72 Auto 6.00 Start Aimed 7.46 Auto 9.00 Aimed 7.46 Start Aimed 10.46 Aimed Speed: 2.1 (Reduced to 1.83 with quiver) Clipped Full 0.50 Free Auto 0.50 Free Auto 2.33 Auto 2.33 Auto 4.15 Auto 4.15 Auto 5.98 Auto 5.98 Auto 6.00 Start Aimed 7.80 Auto 9.00 Aimed 7.80 Start Aimed 10.8 Aimed Speed: 2.2 (Reduced to 1.91 with quiver) Clipped Full 0.50 Free Auto 0.50 Free Auto 2.41 Auto 2.41 Auto 4.33 Auto 4.33 Auto 6.00 Start Aimed 6.24 Auto 9.00 Aimed 6.24 Start Aimed 9.24 Aimed Speed: 2.3 (Reduced to 2.00 with quiver) Clipped Full 0.50 Free Auto 0.50 Free Auto 2.50 Auto 2.50 Auto 4.50 Auto 4.50 Auto 6.00 Start Aimed 6.50 Auto 9.00 Aimed 6.50 Start Aimed 9.50 Aimed Speed: 2.4 (Reduced to 2.09 with quiver) Clipped Full 0.50 Free Auto 0.50 Free Auto 2.59 Auto 2.59 Auto 4.67 Auto 4.67 Auto 6.00 Start Aimed 6.76 Auto 9.00 Aimed 6.76 Start Aimed 9.76 Aimed Speed: 2.5 (Reduced to 2.17 with quiver) Clipped Full 0.50 Free Auto 0.50 Free Auto 2.67 Auto 2.67 Auto 4.85 Auto 4.85 Auto 6.00 Start Aimed 7.02 Auto 9.00 Aimed 7.02 Start Aimed 10.02 Aimed Speed: 2.6 (Reduced to 2.26 with quiver) Clipped Full 0.50 Free Auto 0.50 Free Auto 2.76 Auto 2.76 Auto 5.02 Auto 5.02 Auto 6.00 Start Aimed 7.28 Auto 9.00 Aimed 7.28 Start Aimed 10.28 Aimed Speed: 2.7 (Reduced to 2.35 with quiver) Clipped Full 0.50 Free Auto 0.50 Free Auto 2.85 Auto 2.85 Auto 5.20 Auto 5.20 Auto 6.00 Start Aimed 7.54 Auto 9.00 Aimed 7.54 Start Aimed 10.54 Aimed Speed: 2.8 (Reduced to 2.43 with quiver) Clipped Full 0.50 Free Auto 0.50 Free Auto 2.93 Auto 2.93 Auto 5.37 Auto 5.37 Auto 6.00 Start Aimed 7.80 Auto 9.00 Aimed 7.80 Start Aimed 10.8 Aimed Speed: 2.9 (Reduced to 2.52 with quiver) Clipped Full 0.50 Free Auto 0.50 Free Auto 3.02 Auto 3.02 Auto 5.54 Auto 5.54 Auto 6.00 Start Aimed 8.07 Auto 9.00 Aimed 8.07 Start Aimed 11.07 Aimed Speed: 3.0 (Reduced to 2.61 with quiver) Clipped Full 0.50 Free Auto 0.50 Free Auto 3.11 Auto 3.11 Auto 5.72 Auto 5.72 Auto 6.00 Start Aimed 8.33 Auto 9.00 Aimed 8.33 Start Aimed 11.33 Aimed Speed: 3.1 (Reduced to 2.70 with quiver) Clipped Full 0.50 Free Auto 0.50 Free Auto 3.20 Auto 3.20 Auto 5.89 Auto 5.89 Auto 6.00 Start Aimed 8.59 Auto 9.00 Aimed 8.59 Start Aimed 11.59 Aimed Speed: 3.2 (Reduced to 2.78 with quiver) Clipped Full 0.50 Free Auto 0.50 Free Auto 3.28 Auto 3.28 Auto 6.00 Start Aimed 6.07 Auto 9.00 Aimed 6.07 Start Aimed 9.07 Aimed Speed: 3.3 (Reduced to 2.87 with quiver) Clipped Full 0.50 Free Auto 0.50 Free Auto 3.37 Auto 3.37Auto 6.00 Start Aimed 6.24Auto 9.00 Aimed 6.24Start Aimed 9.24Aimed Speed: 3.4 (Reduced to 2.96 with quiver) Clipped Full 0.50 Free Auto 0.50 Free Auto 3.46 Auto 3.46 Auto 6.00 Start Aimed 6.41 Auto 9.00 Aimed 6.41 Start Aimed 9.41 Aimed =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Normalization =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= HUH, NORMALIZATION? Quote from the patch-notes, regarding the normalization of melee weapon attacks. Bold emphasis my own: The mechanics of most instant melee attacks have been modified to improve item balance. Previously, instant melee attacks did damage based on the damage range of the weapon, plus a bonus for the player's attack power. This bonus was then multiplied by the speed of the weapon. As a result, slow weapons did more damage than was intended, and fast weapons were considered inferior by most players. We have changed the way the attack power bonus is calculated for instant attacks. This change does NOT affect attack power calculations for normal melee attacks. Instead of multiplying by the speed of the weapon, the attack power bonus is now multiplied by a fixed number pulled from the following table: + Two-handed weapons: 3.3 + Daggers: 1.7 + All other one-handed weapons: 2.4 As a direct result of this, many weapons have shifted position in their relative power. In particular, many Epic (purple) quality items are now more powerful than slower Superior (blue) weapons. This change was not made to reduce the power of instant attacks, but to correct the relative imbalance of weapon itemization. At a given level requirement, epic quality weapons should always be more powerful than superior quality weapons. Please also note that all normal weapon swings will be completely unaffected by this change. The following abilities are affected by the design change: Sinister Strike, Ambush, Backstab, Whirlwind, Mortal Strike, and Overpower. For hunters, Multi-Shot and Aimed Shot now use 2.8 instead of weapon speed. --- However, as we can see from the above posts, weapon speed is still too major an influence, with item quality and level being secondary; while it should be opposite. Bloodseeker (item level 63, rare quality) has a slightly higher damage potential than Huhuran's Stinger (item level 78, epic quality). Basically, I believe the normalization should have lead to [Epic with higher DPS] > [Rare with lower DPS], regardless of weapon speed. In addition, the following should also be true in most cases: [Epic with higher item level] > [Epic with lower item level]. However, I do think that weapon speed should have some influence, like it has for other classes. I believe normalization in its current form failed. With gear attainable at the moment, by varying weapon speed only, the total DPS output might change by almost 80 DPS. With a 50 DPS weapon, that's about 1.6 times what the weapon's raw DPS is. While this is with optimal cycle timing (meaning in real gameplay the difference most likely would be reduced slightly), the values are from a talent spec that isn't the most optimal for raiding. It does not include 5/5 Improved Aspect of the Hawk; I'm not satisfied with my current formula for it. Using the values from this post, Unahorn made a graph showing total DPS relative to weapon speed: http://media.wow-praetorians.co.uk/albums/userpics/10016/WeaponSpeedDPS.jpg To support my claim, I'll use a fairly standard Marksman spec (let's say 0/31/20), and show the damage potential a weapon would have, with DPS being constant, and weapon speed changing. I use the stats of a tier 3 hunter, since this makes the problem. It's important to remember the same principles also apply to lower tiered hunters. I am not considering Slaying talents, since they don't work against all mobs, with very few mobs in Naxxramas (where the gear needed for this setup is collected) being valid targets. While all this also due to some itemization flaws (adding fast weapons are, in a raid setting, mostly useless), I think that's a seperate issue. Itemization was an issue before the normalization patch, the normalization should have taken current (and upcoming) weapons into account, allowing for future upgrades in better way than what we currently have. A big factor, I think, for implementing normalization, was a level 23 green weapon. Pre-normalization, it was, due to its 3.4 speed, better than most ranged weapons including Molten Core gear. Post-normalization, this is no longer the case. However, with better gear being added, and tier 2 becoming more accessible than ever before, we can yet again see the flaws of the ranged combat system. Short summary of results: Worst optimal cycle: 489.32 DPS (1.5 weapon, 1.30 quiver speed, full) Best optimal cycle: 568.6 DPS (3.4 weapon, 2.96 quiver speed, full) Difference: 79.28 DPS BLUE WORDS Thanks to Crezax (EU CM), this concern has been forwarded: I'll make sure the right people see the post. That's all I can say for now I am afraid. I could say "interesting numbers" I guess, but some people would lynch me if I did. I don't personally know enough about this to say if it is intended or not.
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