Battleground queue chat commands

[Xudojnik 904]

When Warsong week starts, you can put Warsong battlemasters in all towns. It will work just fine and will not break immersion.

Same with Arathi and so on

[Kadir 136]

Yeah Yenza, i'm all about the results of such initiative. Anything which really increase the frequency of battlegrounds and intensity of world pvp, be that the BG commands or such item or anything else, will get my support.

 

Some ppl might not trust custom features at all at first, but this one was tested and liked throughout the years. I feel we should give it a chance again.

[j9a2per1990 32]

Guys, you have right, but still.. vote. We need public vote about this.

[Xudojnik 904]

It was already done.

You created this poll about the commands with your own hands Queeky:

http://www.strawpoll.me/10766927/r

Enforcing decision against the voice of majority will likely drive more ppl away then anything else.

[j9a2per1990 32]

This it is too early. Maybe we wait for more ppl, because who are now manority voters? Ppl from Valkyrie. Btw i'm all-blizzlike fan, but with this commands you have maybe, but just maybe right, when i think about this.. but main reason why i don't want this commands is worry. Now in game we apply these commands, after we apply instant portal between city, after cheaper riding and more, more.. ... ...

[Chunass 14]

This it is too early. Maybe we wait for more ppl, because who are now manority voters? Ppl from Valkyrie. Btw i'm all-blizzlike fan, but with this commands you have maybe, but just maybe right, when i think about this.. but main reason why i don't want this commands is worry. Now in game we apply these commands, after we apply instant portal between city, after cheaper riding and more, more.. ... ...

If they were going to put in such commands they would most certainly have done so during the 7 years that Valkyrie has been up. That's not going to happen.

[Kadir 136]

We've got around 900 online so far and just 5 ppl on bg, those commands would certainly help to increase pvp. It could be good idea to just reg to bg if you have enough of lvling.

[Zeriex 0]

Bring back the bg commands or put it up to a vote. Maybe at least for below lvl 60s.

 

One of the main reasons I signed up for this server is the PVP, and the bg commands would help grow the low lvl PVP scene and keep it alive for the low population the server has.

[lalazors 4]

Keep it blizzlike please and do not allow any commands for this фекал, its not a "fun" server. Seriously, keep it real or you can shut down the server immediately!

[Kadir 136]

 

 

Keep it blizzlike please and do not allow any commands for this фекал, its not a "fun" server. Seriously, keep it real or you can shut down the server immediately!

 

Their other realm have them working since 7 years and somehow there are no complaints and they are not shutting down. Seriously I think that you didn't even check how well they increase pvp, but form negative opinion because... such things didn't work on other servers? I can reasure you that those commands were tested and worked well on Valkyrie for years. We don't try to implement some product of imagination, but working and tested feature.

 

 

 

Bring back the bg commands or put it up to a vote.

 

There was a poll here:

 

http://www.strawpoll.me/10766927/r

 

And was ignored.

Edited August 19, 2016 by Kadir

[Motorbreath 923]

Whanna hear an opinion of the player who first proposed implementation of the .bg commans to Valkyrie admins five or six years ago?

 

It's one of my biggest mistakes. Scratch that - it is by far the biggest, judging by how it affected the server I'm so fond of: the commands ruined PvP experience for many, many players including myself over the years and lead to the pityful situation that many Valkyrie players are so familiar with.

 

Did it boost PvP activity, especially on low levels? Hell yeah. But what you're missing here and what I missed back then is quantity against quality.

 

Implementing such commands will bring a lot of random people to battlegrounds, which may look like a good thing, untill your victory depends on the people who are thinking about their PvE farm and marks instead of the current battleground goals all the time.

 

In the further and more global perspective it will cause or at least enhance things like widening gear gap between people getting high PvP ranks and these random folks, that still join battlegrounds for marks and midfight fun, but don't wanna try harder for the win and eventually develop the famous thinking pattern as a result: "we can't win against those, it's no fun trying, let's just loose fast for 1 mark so I could go farm ores".

 

As you can see, it will boost activity, but you should probably put quotes around that "activity".

 

And guess what. You can do the very same by asking people in capitals to que you as a group or promoting battleground activity in global chat. So the commands would also reduce player to player interaction and that's why we are playing classic WoW instead of retail here, right?

 

PvP/PvE division is there for a reason. You either spend your time on one. Or on another.

 

You can try doing both, but guess what. You will aquire less as a result.

 

Saving time by such non-Blizzlike commands is basically tweaking the system just like increased exp rates and all that.

 

I'm definetly with Elysium admins on that - Valkyrie team has been listening to their players too much. And even though I'm one of the players, and it's the same people administrating both realms sometimes, I'm thinking that maybe the time has finally come for all of us to learn from our mistakes.

Edited August 19, 2016 by Motorbreath

[Xudojnik 904]

Motorbreath, you are not right because you treat PvP players as hardcore terminators dedicated in killing other players.

PvP is not club for elite personalities.

Let casual players to play too.

Let people to do their mistakes. Even in PvP.

 

If you concerned with the fact that your team loses because of noobish teammates, then you need to gather good team for yourself.

Elite clubs tend to lose quantity over time because no player will be here forever.

Open community tend to grow because noobish ones will eventually learn how to play.

 

You can even see how elite community ends here.

[Motorbreath 923]

I'm just trying to treat everyone equally.

 

And that's what everyone including admins should be doing by keeping Blizzlike as a common ground instead of listening to just one party and changing the game for everyone on this party's behalf imo.

 

Even if that group is the majority or a vocal minority. That's what lead to retail turning into what it is now. It's really the decision between those players who want to change the rules and the ones that are willing to play by them.

 

You can win short-term, but eventually loose the long run as Blizzard's example has shown us.

 

Some may say, that they weren't listening to the players and that it's exactly their mistake: "You think, that you do, but you don't" and all that. But I'd rather go a bit deeper than memes and the surface hilarity of the phrase itself, and say, that players probably have been asking a lot of different and sometimes directly opposite things at the same time from the company.

 

The point being: people don't always know what's better for them, and when they will know it may be too late.

 

So yeah: let everyone make their own mistakes. Just don't turn it into everyone's problem by making the mistake server-wide.

 

Also I was very surprized to know that after playing only pug battlegrounds against rank farming premades for years I'm suddenly the one turning PvP into an elite club. And why should I gather a good team for myself? I enjoy the difficult challenges and still PvPing only for one-one and a half hour long WSGs and such.

 

Don't you think, that it would be good though, if the newbs were motivated to gather a good team for themselves instead of whining for the command implementation, never trying to learn anything by themselves, and giving up on the PvP when there is no leader around?

 

From the recent discussions on the topic in the russian part of these forums  I've been getting an impression, that you're all for the human interaction and self-organization. Maybe it's me myself and not my position on the topic you're argueing with? Because right now I'm basically repeating what you've been saying back there.

[Xudojnik 904]

Battleground registration command used to be the great boost to low level PvP. It was nearly impossible to start 10-19 without it.

 

I think that admins should make a decision. But I think it should be based on something other than "blizzlike" term neither opinion of "vocal minority".

There are pros and cons of this feature in terms of community management. They should be weighted and taken into account.

 

How do you think, where new players are supposed to do their first mistakes? On battlegrounds full of "good teams" or on random cocktail of solo players and parties?

 

You don't need any social skills to start playing by battlemaster registration either by command registration.

Battleground registration is used by dedicated PvP players. Command registration is used by players prone to PvP.

If a player who is only prone to PvP decides to join to dedicated PvP by battlemaster, he will have to match their level. Only a number are able to.

If a player prone to PvP decides to join to casual PvP by command, it will be easier for him to begin.

 

I'm all for human interaction, but battleground command is not about interactions. It is about average level of participants.

Not-dedicated player will leave if he will not match the level.

Dedicated player will not leave if there are many noobs.

[Kadir 136]

Motorbreath, I don't think it's right to treat BG as an unique feature and to prepare for it like for Christmass cause it proced once per hour. It's a platform of entertainment. Same like a raid, like an event, like quests like everything else in this game. What are you gonna do with it, it's up to you but it must exist. Rest is ideology.

 

It's not true that pvp and pve can't be or shouldn't be done by same person. Somehow on Valkyrie Hordecore had no trouble with both (including me). On Nostalrius there were also ppl who had done both (including ppl in my guild), because actually 10k people could provide enough platform for such things. Server community should live as one, not devided into 2 ghettos with everything separated especially on private server. You like such division and I don't. We don't have enough population for such experiments.

 

More popular pvp doesn't exclude emerging of leaders, on the contrary it actually increases it, cause of quantity of participants and natural instinct to get above the average level.

 

Waiting in queue for an hour does not motivate anyone, it actually provoke to asking if you had chosen right server, cause there is no platform for pvp. Constant fighting against others and discovering that you could do better can motivate.

 

Blizzard by year 2006 had over 20 opened classic servers and could cover mistakes with population management by constant migrations between realms. Here there is only one realm Elysium, there is no room for mistakes. What was good for such company may not work here, cause of difference in scale of the project. In my opinion Elysium can benefit a lot more from close cooperation of admins and playerbase cause simply, one can't exist without the other. And will not benefit from blindly following everything what was done by others. Realm must have it's own strategy for survival on the classic scene. In my opinion this strategy should include BG commands for increasing of frequency of BG procs. (Like it was tested and worked before, thats nothing new).

[j9a2per1990 32]

DEVs just can try apply your commands after fiasco from last night. I mean now topic about increase raids stats for boss, trash. Did you see that? People and now i don't mean still same ppl like you, Kadir, don't need these chandes, so don't waste your time with this, guys. /peace and enjoy our new realm

[Xudojnik 904]

I think j9a2per is against registration command only because we are against changing raids stats. This is childish.

 

Take into account that increasing boss stats is a barrier for availability of raids. Higher stats will decrease amount of raiders.

Battleground command is opposite - it will increase amount of pvp players.

 

Both features are not blizzlike, but battleground command allows more players to participate.

[Kadir 136]

Don't worry, we know each other with Motorbreath since 2010 year and it's always been a pleasure to discuss things with him. We enjoy the realm and also enjoyed the previous realm which those same admins created but also try to think forward and discuss improvements.

Edited August 19, 2016 by Kadir

[j9a2per1990 32]

I think j9a2per is against registration command only because we are against changing raids stats. This is childish.

 

No, no Xudo. I'm against command very long and same problem i see in changing raids stats. Just make server as much as possible like classic WoW. This is what I want.

[Kadir 136]

You don't trust that, what worked once may as well work again? Ofc sticking to everything blizzlike is safe, but its also blind copy without adressing an issue of not very active pvp. Low activity of pvp is a non blizzlike thing to me.

[Darkaxe 1]

I think that it need to return commands as .bg. It's easy to stay in queue when u are finally 60 lvl and after raids or 5-10 ppl u defend the tree or mailbox in capitals. But when u lvling, u cant spend much time there. In this case, many ppl give preference for farming and lvling, but if ull give them such opportunity, they also will play BG. 1-59 PVP very interesting, so u need to develop it. Return the commands and low lvl pvp will live.

[earth 3]

WE WANT PVP ON VALKYRIE, RETURN VALKYRIE PVP 

[Motorbreath 923]

Motorbreath, I don't think it's right to treat BG as an unique feature and to prepare for it like for Christmass cause it proced once per hour. It's a platform of entertainment. Same like a raid, like an event, like quests like everything else in this game. What are you gonna do with it, it's up to you but it must exist. Rest is ideology.

 

Yeah, I'm totally with you on this one. Let's not treat BG as an unique feature boosting it with non-Blizzlike commands. Or shall we implement meeting stone teleportation too, because it also "takes soooooo long to actually run there, uhhh"?

"Must exist", in the other hand... Nah. Not if the nesessary amount of players is interested enough.

 

It's not true that pvp and pve can't be or shouldn't be done by same person. Somehow on Valkyrie Hordecore had no trouble with both (including me). On Nostalrius there were also ppl who had done both (including ppl in my guild), because actually 10k people could provide enough platform for such things.

 

"It's not true that pvp and pve can't be or shouldn't be done by same person."

Wait. Did I actually say that?

Oh, right. I did not. Look what I said: "You can try doing both, but guess what. You will aquire less as a result."

I didn't have much trouble doing both on Valkyrie and Nost myself, but I would progress faster in one aspect of the game if I simply didn't participate in another.

There are only 24 hours in a day, you know.

 

 

Server community should live as one, not devided into 2 ghettos with everything separated especially on private server. You like such division and I don't. We don't have enough population for such experiments.

 

Yes. That's exactly what I'm talking about. Wait... Do I? What?!

 

Waiting in queue for an hour does not motivate anyone, it actually provoke to asking if you had chosen right server, cause there is no platform for pvp. Constant fighting against others and discovering that you could do better can motivate.

 

That's if everyone is waiting and not doing anything to break the mold.

Blaming the server, the administration and everyone else instead of doing something by yourself is a popular tendency, yes.

Keep asking for commands and tweaks, those will make PvP great so you won't have to.

 

Blizzard by year 2006 had over 20 opened classic servers and could cover mistakes with population management by constant migrations between realms. Here there is only one realm Elysium, there is no room for mistakes. What was good for such company may not work here, cause of difference in scale of the project. In my opinion Elysium can benefit a lot more from close cooperation of admins and playerbase cause simply, one can't exist without the other. And will not benefit from blindly following everything what was done by others. Realm must have it's own strategy for survival on the classic scene. In my opinion this strategy should include BG commands for increasing of frequency of BG procs. (Like it was tested and worked before, thats nothing new).

 

There is the whole classic emulation scene nowadays, but yeah, I can catch your drift.

 

And instead of argueing about all these things let's clear something out here, shall we? Back at Valkyrie the .bg command was used and hailed because it's been helping to get enough random people into weakly PvP standing, so dedicated PvP players could get their r13-r14 despite the server's low online or, in the better days, to get it faster.

 

By farming honor from undergeared PvE players at 60-60 bracket and by PvP standing widening in the form of 25 honor kills farm from the leveling folk at 10-19 WSG.

 

That's the division I'm talking about and it's not me who is separating players here by proposing it's implementation again. I'm just against server administration and playerbase manipulation in the name of your own personal benefit here.

 

I wonder why should I explain all this to the players, who were there and have seen it all with their own eyes.

[Motorbreath 923]

UPD.

Oh, and one last little thing. I'll use my former guildie's quote to demonstrate that. I hope he won't mind.

 

...when u lvling, u cant spend much time there. In this case, many ppl give preference for farming and lvling...

 

The game starts at lvl 60 don't you know? The players are leveling now. I'll loosely quote Xud on this: "there is no low-level PvP because there is no profit in doing it".

The realm is only three days old, and yet here we go again...

"We're doomed! The realm will fall! We need zee commands!"

Edited August 20, 2016 by Motorbreath

[Kadir 136]

 

Or shall we implement meeting stone teleportation too

 

That's not a topic about it and you will not find any of my posts suggesting it, cause it simply makes no sence. This is a topic only about BG commands and let's stick to it

 

 

 

"Must exist", in the other hand... Nah. Not if the nesessary amount of players is interested enough.

 

Five basic questions ppl ask me about any server wherever I move are:

1. If it's stable without crashes and rollbacks.

2. How big is the population.

3. How well is it scripted.

4. What kind of raid content is open and if there are enough guilds which can clear it.

5. Status of pvp on the server (time in queue for bg, quantity of ppl in honor standing, how many bgs are in progress simultaneously etc).

What should I tell them? That the improvement which intensified pvp was reversed? Amount of players on the server is actually determined by what kind of entertainment server can provide. More active pvp is a factor which can attract even more ppl to stay here.

 

 

 

"You can try doing both, but guess what. You will aquire less as a result."

 

Don't you understand that it's a reason enough to split population to 2 factions having nothing in common with each other? On a private server with population of middle size. Because you have to choose one to maximise gain there are lot less ppl who can afford choosing both, means... activity is lower on both fields. That's exactly why we would like to recommend this command, because it makes BG more popular and available for wider spectrum of ppl and less of your precious time is spent in queue.

 

 

Blaming the server, the administration and everyone else instead of doing something by yourself is a popular tendency, yes.

Keep asking for commands and tweaks, those will make PvP great so you won't have to.

 

I don't live in a dream idealistic world and know how ppl react to low frequency of bg procs.

 

 

 

Back at Valkyrie the .bg command was used and hailed because it's been helping to get enough random people into weakly PvP standing, so dedicated PvP players could get their r13-r14 despite the server's low online or, in the better days, to get it faster.

 

What is bad actually in finding sollution to old realm problems? We're back to the part of what is and what is not possible on the server and how it affect online. Do you think that the pvp films promoting the server created by Hordecore would be possible without active pvp?

 

 

 

By farming honor from undergeared PvE players at 60-60 bracket and by PvP standing widening in the form of 25 honor kills farm from the leveling folk at 10-19 WSG.

 

If you're biased against HC, tell it openly. But forming opinion that we fought against undergeared oponents when other faction cleared weekly 3 BWLs to our one is somewhat ridiculous. 

 

 

 

manipulation in the name of your own personal benefit

 

You brought such a big cannon with you but... missed! Pvp here was always a team effort.

 

 

 

The game starts at lvl 60 don't you know?

 

No  Check the warsong faction vendor.

 

P.S. Sorry that it's so long but we're gonna make this topic epic together with Motorbreath 

Edited August 20, 2016 by Kadir