The Spell Hit debate

[Denbts 3]

Semi-crosspost from general forums: Do we have any proof that spell crit is calculated on a two-roll system? If not, we're gearing ourselves entirely wrong. In retail, the damage dealt by a spell was determined with a two-roll system. The game first calculated whether you'd hit the mob before deciding whether you'd crit. If you hit, your crit chance was then factored in as normal, but if you didn't hit, your crit chance was effectively 0. 

In a one-roll system, however, crits and hits, along with dodge, parry, glancing, crushing, etc, are all calculated simultaneously. You can't have a "missed crit" or a "dodged crushing blow" or a "missed glance" because they are all independent of one another. This is how melee attacks work. 

Some private servers mistakenly use a one-roll system for spells, which changes stat values significantly. Imagine Denbts the warlock has  a 90% chance to hit, and 15% crit chance. Depending on the server he's on, this can mean two very different things: 

On a two-roll server, if Denbts casts 1,000 shadow bolts, 900 will land and 15% of those (or 135 shadow bolts) will crit. On a one-roll server, however, crit chance is out of the total amount of spells cast, not spells that land, meaning that 150 spells will crit, and 90% of the remaining 850 spells will land. In the first scenario, hit is better; in the second, crit is better. 

 

My question is, which kind of server are we on? There have been a few private servers in the past that actually calculated spells with a one-roll system, and although we were pretty sure it was a two-roll system on Nostalrius, we could never 100% confirm it beyond a shadow of a doubt. Does anyone know how we can test this, seeing as there aren't any level 63 target dummies around? 

Edited January 16, 2017 by Denbts

[Digge 0]

AFAIK Casts have always been on a one-roll system, at  least of you don't take partial resists into the equation.

 

[Numi 0]

That entirely depends on the one roll system being used, 1% crit might reduce chance for a normal hit by 1%

See this:

10% crit 0% hit:

0-9: crit

10-82: hit

83-99: miss

vs 

15% crit 0% hit:

0-14: crit

15-82: hit

83-99: miss

I can't imagine anyone in 2017 making a poor one roll system, crit should never make you hit more spells.

[Guybrush 11]

Elysium is based on Mangos and Nostalrius which are 2 roll. I see no reason for them to change.

What server even uses 1 roll?

[Ayeri 6]

so Guybrush you confirm 100% that Elysium/Anathema is a 2 roll system ?

[Guybrush 11]

1 hour ago, Ayeri said:

so Guybrush you confirm 100% that Elysium/Anathema is a 2 roll system ?

No. Only a dev can.

[Setup 1]

doesn't matter, itemization is too linear for you to do anything with this information, hit and crit are functionally equivalent. 

just stack crit if you like to pvp, since hit is worth nothing to pvpers.

[Timergu 0]

On 2017-02-02 at 7:16 PM, Guybrush said:

No. Only a dev can.

You can test it. Get as much crit as possible and no hit. Cast 10000 shadowbolts on a boss. Post results.