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Tharidor

A overcomplicated Nightfall question.

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Hello ladies and gents!
The question I have in mind, is which seal is better to use with Nightfall? - I'm aware that SoR has twice the chance to proc the effect, but I am still curious about a couple of things.

I want to start off by mentioning my stats. I'm geared very much like a warrior would be, and my current raid dps is average on 250-300 (not wearing any raiding gear at this time, besides Lionheart helmet) - I also thought it was worth mentioning that I am on the Darrowshire PvE server (not sure if this changes things)

Right, so here's my completely unbuffed stats:
0Spell damage.

22.55% crit chance.

768 Attack Power.

Melee weapon Swing damage: 383-493.

9% hit chance.

Current weapon: Arcanite reaper.

Now according to DB Vanilla, the Nightfall weapon is actually not all that bad, but unfortunately this is not the first time that DB.Vanilla is showing the updated stats of something.

So here's the stats of the Nightfall weapon on Darrowshire: 171-258 damage. 3.20 attack speed. 67.0 damage per second. (Proc chance is the same I believe)

My question now, is what seal to use?
SoTc seems good, based on the fact that the weapon swing speed is quite fast.

SoR for the extra proc chance.

Seal of command for sweet personal burst damage.

I wonder, with my current setup, what would be best to use out of these three seals? - When I'm fully stacked in raids with buffs (which is what I'm usually not, because of the fact that my guild is progressing at the moment, so no chance to stack buffs with the added wipe here and there) - my burst dps is 450, with a steady drop down to 350ish.

How significantly worse would SoTc be, compared to command for personal dps? and with my curent setup, I feel that SoR is just absolute garbage for my dps - it's a huge contrast between using command and SoR with my current gear.

Also, according to some, the life-steal enchant seems to be able to proc itself? - someone tested it for me, and he concluded that it has a chance to do just that. I wonder, could the life-steal enchant proc the weapon proc? - since I'm currently running Crusader as my enchant on Arcanite reaper, and I'm thinking of enchanting my Nightfall with life-steal.

Thanks for taking your time to read this!

PS: Would seal "dancing" be a thing? Say... using SoR to proc, then switch to command, and then back to SoR when the debuff falls off?

Edit: How much worse is Nightfall compared to Arcanite reaper for personal dps? (assuming that I would use Seal of Command in raids) - I only ask, because I haven't had a chance to test it myself, and the habit of paladin dps being heavily RNG based.

 

Edited by Tharidor

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Gen you say geared like a warrior, might I ask, why not geared like a paladin?

if your going as ret, using nightfall to help the raid, then your not helping yourself and your not going to contribute as DPS, your contributing as a support to the DPS.

Overall that's fine, but you can't be using nightfall and expecting to be top dps.

Nightfall is ment to be a raid boost when it procs, that's it. It has descent damage, but it's not meant to be a primary dps weapon to help the player using, it's meant to help the raid.

I applaud any Paladin who can step into a raid as Ret, because it's not easily to be accepted, nor pull it off.

when I see Paladins equipping Nightfall, I realize the raid only wanted a buff slave, who was going to boost the raid dps not the paladin.

If the paladin is ok with that, all is good.

they just need to know it's not about the paladin doing Dps, it's just a player there boosting everyone be else's.

 

Edit: on a side. It's, if your rocking arc reaper in raids, keep doing what you do bud! Show the raid your own personal DPS, but you need spell dmg/Int gear later on to push yourself. 

keep showing naysayers that Ret is possible, much like Smitter and Theloras does!

Edited by JCarrill0

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Long story short - don't use Warrior gear with SoR and don't use Nightfall with SoC or SotC.

Why?

Because if you use warrior gear with SoR, your SoR will hit for $hit.

If you use Nightfall with SoC, the proc rate for both SoC and Nightfall's "Spell Vulnerability" will both be low due to Nightfall's early Vanilla swing speed of 3.2

If you use Warrior gear with SotC and Nightfall, it's overall kinda ok - yes your auto-attack is now 40% faster but you only hit for the same amount as your regular hits (it's not the ZOMG awesome Seal it was back on Nost).

Since you have Warrior gear and Arcanite Reaper at 3.8 swing speed, then I would recommend that you keep doing this with Seal of Command. Your personal DPS will be much better overall, especially if you can get a 2nd Ret Paladin so you can stack Judgement of the Crusader ranks.

Otherwise, if you want to use Nightfall or your guild makes it mandatory for you, then you need to start PvPing and get at least the blue PvP set - at that point, you can use Nightfall with SoR and do decent personal DPS but also provide insane raid support as a Ret Paladin using SoR and Nightfall has the highest uptime on its proc of any class/spec in the game now.

As for Seal Twisting, it's not feasible here on Elysium as SoR isn't able to proc off of a yellow attack.

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3 hours ago, Theloras said:

Long story short - don't use Warrior gear with SoR and don't use Nightfall with SoC or SotC.

Why?

Because if you use warrior gear with SoR, your SoR will hit for $hit.

That's biggest issue with overall Paladins in Vanilla , they believe that they should gear up like Warriors :(

/Kind regards Killerduki

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1 hour ago, killerduki said:

That's biggest issue with overall Paladins in Vanilla , they believe that they should gear up like Warriors :(

/Kind regards Killerduki

Very insightful comment Killerduki!

On a serious note though, thank you Theloras and JCarrill0 for responding. I appreciate the help!

Edited by Tharidor

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