The value of Wolfshead Helm

[pichler 1]

Hey guys,

 

I've read in the druid discord chat, that the Wolfshead Helm is supposed to be the BiS for PvE and PvP. (Since this was only an uncontested singular opinion I want to get a bigger sample.)

 

What do you think about it?

 

(Only having energy in mind:) For me - having my in depth vanilla druid experience right in front of me - this doesnt make too much sense since i get 40 energy from the talent Furor and possibly 20 more energy by conincidence from a tick (every 2sec). And there also might be the Talent Omen of Clarity which shrinks the relative importance of energy as well.

 

Will I have the mana to permanently shapeshift in PvE? Does it maybe depend on the gain of 40 or 60 energy?

 

So do you agree on Wolfshead Helm being the alltime BiS for PvE as well as PvP or are the opportunity costs from lacking attributes to high at a certain point?

 

For me PvP is represented by trying to kill your enemy (duels) not only carrying the flag in WSG.

 

I am eager to read your opinions.

 

Greetings,

pichler

[Lorilay 12]

PvP? No, except maybe some weird situation where you can combine it with a long stun and the BWL trinket to spam shred for a bit. PvE? Yes, if you have good latency (and know how to macro powershifting). That said, I'd like to see some math numbers to pinpoint its approximate value (obviously this will scale with your gear, so maybe just assume you're in BiS dps gear for each tier).

[Flecolan 0]

Does this tactic make feral viable in raids?

[Lorilay 12]

Does this tactic make feral viable in raids?

Depends what you mean by viable. If you're asking if it will be more DPS (including buffing your group) than bringing an equally geared DPS class, then the answer is no. But you can do respectable DPS and if your guild isn't trying to min/max to an extreme degree it shouldn't matter.

[Flecolan 0]

Respectable DPS as in: More DPS than for example enhancement shamans or boomkins?

[Wortgewandt 5]

-snip-

 

(Only having energy in mind:) For me - having my in depth vanilla druid experience right in front of me - this doesnt make too much sense since i get 40 energy from the talent Furor and possibly 20 more energy by conincidence from a tick (every 2sec). And there also might be the Talent Omen of Clarity which shrinks the relative importance of energy as well.

 

Will I have the mana to permanently shapeshift in PvE? Does it maybe depend on the gain of 40 or 60 energy?

 

So do you agree on Wolfshead Helm being the alltime BiS for PvE as well as PvP or are the opportunity costs from lacking attributes to high at a certain point?

 

For me PvP is represented by trying to kill your enemy (duels) not only carrying the flag in WSG.

 

-snip-

 

To answer your questions:

 

Wolfshead or go home if you want to feral pve. Key is spamming shred as perfectly timed as possible. Shift + tick + helmet.

 

Mana: No you wont. If you time accuratly, for BWL and above, you will need either a greater mana pot, or a flask of wisdom. You run out of mana after around 4 minutes of shapeshifting.

 

Yes, yes it is BiS forever in PVE (DPS that is).

[Undertanker 88]

Get runes as well and Lei of Lillies (works as a conjour item) and can have multiple ones but they disappear when you log for the day.  Helps save money on runes.

 

 

Also get an energy watch add-on to ensure you are not powershifting before your energy ticks. 

[Wortgewandt 5]

Also get an energy watch add-on to ensure you are not powershifting before your energy ticks. 

 

Additionally to that, create a macro for the catshift that will prohibit you to shift out of cat if you are above 30 energy.

[Undertanker 88]

More like 20.   If your next energy tick would let you do an ability, wait for that and push yourself to zero.  (what ever the hell your energy cost are, been 8 months since leveling my druid)

 

Just make sure it's only on your powershift macro and not on all abilities

Edited December 16, 2016 by Undertanker

[Wortgewandt 5]

More like 20.   If your next energy tick would let you do an ability, wait for that and push yourself to zero.  (what ever the hell your energy cost are, been 8 months since leveling my druid)

 

Just make sure it's only on your powershift macro and not on all abilities

 

30, because with imrpoved shred, you gain another shred with the next tick, with 20, you'll need 2 ticks.

 

Arguably i believe it is more efficient to shred than to use a claw and push youself to 0 in this as it would complicate an already silly rotation

 

PS: I'm so glad to get my feral back!

Edited December 16, 2016 by Wortgewandt

[Undertanker 88]

Yeah then 30.  Couldn't remember the ability energy cost.

 

And yeah, you don't want to put weak DoTs on the boss.  People will get annoyed.

Edited December 16, 2016 by Undertanker

[Undertanker 88]

Don't forget to farm plenty of Manual Crowd Pummelers to bring to raids.  

[Res 0]

How big is the DPS increase over let's say the second best item?
You say there is no better item, what kind of stats would an item have had to have to compare?
Are we talking 10 times better, more? Less?
As far as I know this item is still in-game on retail with the same effect, Why don't high level druids use it?

I'm thinking at some point stats must've out-valued the effect?

I'm just curious! Thanks!

[Wortgewandt 5]

How big is the DPS increase over let's say the second best item?

You say there is no better item, what kind of stats would an item have had to have to compare?

Are we talking 10 times better, more? Less?

As far as I know this item is still in-game on retail with the same effect, Why don't high level druids use it?

I'm thinking at some point stats must've out-valued the effect?

I'm just curious! Thanks!

 

It will not be BiS anymore once your whitehits average dps is near equal to a shred noncrit. After shredding, it will take up to 6 seconds to regen enough energy for another shred. With shifting, it will take 4 secons. With powershift (shift + helmet) it will take only take aslong as you need to powershift for another shred.

 

Rotation without helmet: Shred, tick, tick, shred, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, shred

Rotation with helmet: Shred, tick, tick, shred, shift, tick, shred, shift, tick, shred, shift, tick, shred.

 

Shift + Tick will take roughly 1.5 seconds if done correctly and without too much serverlag.

 

Helmet becomes obsolete, once your aa's do enough or more dps in the time of ticks waiting for shred then an actual shred. However, this does not happen until TBC.

Edited December 16, 2016 by Wortgewandt

[taladril 43]

Anyone know if the effect of the crowd pummeler is supposed to stay on the person as a buff or get lost if you switch out of it? I guess its dps would still be great even if you are keeping it on you the whole time while using it.

[Lorilay 12]

I'd have to test it again to be sure, but I'm pretty sure you lose the buff if you swap out the weapon.

[taladril 43]

That is probably the correct functionality. Hope it would be correct on nost too. May have to start farming those >.<

[Undertanker 88]

It is lost. Tested it on warrior when leveling.