Pondering need & greed.

[Metabolomics 2]

I've been thinking about the need/greed question for boe items and trying to come up with a real(ish) world analogy. I'd like to hear if anyone has other better examples!

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Two homeless people out in the cold, one has a nice warm jacket, the other doesn't. Along comes a good Samaritan with, would you believe it, a spare warm jacket! He offers it to the two homeless people. 

You could argue that both 'need' the jacket as it has a monetary value and could be used directly or indirectly to purchase something like a hot meal or somewhere to stay for the night.

I'd argue that the 'right' thing to do (in a world which isn't entirely selfish) is for the homeless person who already has the nice warm jacket to let the other homeless person have it.

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[TheDruidCode 28]

You need to consider that the person with the jacket doesn't have any pants. So one can get a jacket, the other can sell it and get some pants. Being pantless ain't fun.

[Greenkarma 1]

Item upgrade - need.

Item with no upgrade over item what on you - greed. If nobody needs it and u get it,sell it or use it for other class build.

Profession,recipes and other stuff - need. Sell it or use it for yourself.

Its the way to go?

 

 

 

[Oakenlix 79]

While I understand your example, I'd like to note that it's completely irrelevant to the discussion about loot rules.

Why?

Because the "Gear upgrade = Need, else Greed" system doesn't care about poor people same as "Need on all BoEs". 

"Gear upgrade = Need, else Greed" suggests that a poor mage can't roll on a BoE axe to sell it, even if the warrior for whom it's a gear upgrade is rich.

"Need on all BoEs" suggests that a rich mage has the same right to roll on a BoE axe as a poor warrior.

Neither of those systems are able to provide the poorest group member with a drop. 

A copy-pase from one of my previous posts:

Quote

Whether its the "Need on all BoEs" or the so called "Need before greed" system, it doesn't change the value distibution between poor and rich people not by one bit, so its an irrelevant argument. And also I think you realize that rolling based on investigating each player's wealth would be a mess.

 

So yeah, a nice example of how it would ideally be better to distribute loot, still it doesn't help us at all in discussing which system is better in practice.

 

Edited March 1, 2017 by Oakenlix

[Justme 9]

I would never party someone with no jacket so he doesn't even get to roll against me

[Kelgoroth 1]

Difference is that in real life it affects a humans health while in game you should not care how much money the other one has. Also : Everyone could say he is poor and always roll need.

 

Item upgrade (which you will be using!) - need. Otherwise greed.

I would only use other rules if they were communicated before and all agreed on them.

[Metabolomics 2]

2 hours ago, Oakenlix said:

While I understand your example, I'd like to note that it's completely irrelevant to the discussion about loot rules.

Why?

Because the "Gear upgrade = Need, else Greed" system doesn't care about poor people same as "Need on all BoEs". 

"Gear upgrade = Need, else Greed" suggests that a poor mage can't roll on a BoE axe to sell it, even if the warrior for whom it's a gear upgrade is rich.

"Need on all BoEs" suggests that a rich mage has the same right to roll on a BoE axe as a poor warrior.

Neither of those systems are able to provide the poorest group member with a drop. 

A copy-pase from one of my previous posts:

 

So yeah, a nice example of how it would ideally be better to distribute loot, still it doesn't help us at all in discussing which system is better in practice.

 

I agree that personal wealth doesn't (and shouldn't) come into either of those loot systems. It doesn't really feature as part of the analogy either - which makes no assumptions about comparative wealth. 

 

[Oakenlix 79]

@Metabolomics

So what's the point of this thread then? Maybe I'm missing something here.

[Metabolomics 2]

Purely an intellectual exercise in constructing an analogy which adequately represents one or more looting systems which may or may not then allow people to look at said system from a new perspective. 

 

[Slonne 127]

game =/= real life. Progress here is like on stairs and all are equal, all have house, all can farm gold and do dungeons, if someone here is without a jacket it means that he is lazy noskilled player.

need is for wear

greed is for sale.

[mytchi3 1]

16 hours ago, Slonne said:

game =/= real life. Progress here is like on stairs and all are equal, all have house, all can farm gold and do dungeons, if someone here is without a jacket it means that he is lazy noskilled player.

need is for wear

greed is for sale.

No

[Metabolomics 2]

17 hours ago, Slonne said:

game =/= real life. Progress here is like on stairs and all are equal, all have house, all can farm gold and do dungeons, if someone here is without a jacket it means that he is lazy noskilled player.

need is for wear

greed is for sale.

I'm going to assume there are people who have better gear than you in the game. Does that make you lazy and noskilled? 

[Jdude2021 1]

1 hour ago, mytchi3 said:

No

Yes.

 

11 minutes ago, Metabolomics said:

I'm going to assume there are people who have better gear than you in the game. Does that make you lazy and noskilled? 

and it doesn't make you lazy, it just means you don't know how to make money/get better gear, so in other words.. Yes, No skill.

[mytchi3 1]

@Jman420 I disagree with your greed need system. Greed on low cost greens is what most people do, however if its nature res ring green for example everyone should need also on certain mats and ofc boe epics and blues.

Edited March 3, 2017 by mytchi3

[keck82 1]

need>greed even on boe imho if you want everyone to need on boe you should warn the group BEFORE you start

it just sucks when everyone greeds and one guy decides he wants to sell that item...

Edited March 6, 2017 by keck82