Wienersteve, a cautionary tale.

[wienersteve 0]

    My Character Wienersteve was suspended for 2 weeks, during the wave of bans for wintrading.  I will maintain that I absolutely never wintraded knowingly, or gained any benefit from the supposed wintrading.  The screenshot I was included in was the only time I was ever suspicious of the chinese premade that I played with many times, with no evidence of rulebreaking activity.  Many rankers can confirm that I was a legitimate and respected ranker in the community for the long duration of my ranking career and was not ever involved in wintrading or any other pvp activity that broke the terms of service.   
     
    I was stacked with the rest of the bracket 1 rankers, and was sitting at 96% of R14.I got taken to GM Island and suspended only 2 hours before the honor reset.  From what
I understood reading about other people who were suspended (from the dodger banwave) and some players whose permanent bans were converted to 1 week bans, my rank points should still have been applied.  I should have hit High Warlord, and been able to purchase my weapons upon returning, which is most of the reason I did not pursue any further ban appeals or try to get things fixed.  

    That being said, I have no idea what GM I spoke to when they ported me to GM Island as they kept their identity concealed.  From the beginning of our conversation I was on the defensive, and it seemed as if I was guilty to him from the moment we started talking.  What he ended up asking for was the names of players that I pvped with in that group or he would permanently ban me, with a 2 week suspension (2 hours before the end of a legitimate pvp grind lasting months) being the lesser alternative.  This of course put me in a position to be scared to challenge him on anything. I am currently the guild leader of the guild Pantheon, and wield its only Thunderfury from old nostalrius and mostly during this conversation I was more concerned to save my characters at all, rather than ask for more proof.  This GM, said that the premade I played with was 100% guilty and I was "involved".  I was never shown any proof of this, and in the thread about the wintrading it has been clearly stated that the screenshot I was in was not the only evidence for the bans/suspensions.  He seemed to imply that I was involved multiple times in known wintrading, which is completely untrue.  Some of the Pvpers were invited many times to the NA/EU premade.  During late night NA times (3AM-9AM server) many NA players would happily invite chinese players like Hellopippo, Savoiedecka, Mengxiaoyu, and others to our groups and they would invite some of us to theirs, depending on the time of the night and the pvp weekend.   None of us ever suspected any of these "very guilty" pvpers of any elicit pvp activity.  It has been brought to my attention that some of the permanent bans were reverted to 1 week bans and at least one of those players recieved R14 on the same week I was suspended.  

    To conclude I believe that preventing a legitimate Ranker from reaching R14 2 hours before the honor reset, without sufficient evidence was a much more severe punishment than a simple 2 week suspension.  I changed my life completely for months, keeping up a raid leading schedule, rebuilding the core of my guild, and keeping up with honor caps, often sleeping around 3 hours a day, to achieve something I had dreamed of since before nostalrius shut down.  I ask anyone who knows me as a legitimate PvPer and an important member of our servers community to bump this post and help to get a deserved High Warlord rank for somone who had no reason to have it taken away from them.   

TLDR? R14 was taken from me with only hours left until reset with little or no evidence of malicious pvp activity. 

reddit post: https://www.reddit.com/r/ElysiumProject/comments/5y6xae/wienersteve_a_cautionary_tale/

 

Edited March 8, 2017 by wienersteve

[Peplawl 0]

Support this man.

[bago 0]

The amount of time, effort, and dedication required to pull rank 14 is not something to be underestimated. For someone like Steve, who contributes to the positive experience of many players on Anathema (Nostalrius), to not at least be shown clear and concise evidence of his intent to collude and subvert the honor system is unacceptable. 

 

Please review this case Elysium developers.

[Shakur 0]

#HordeLivesMatter

[Euronymous 2]

free this man

 

[IamScythed 0]

GIEF WEAPONS PL0X

[YcbshadowE 1]

#FreeWeiners

[Overtime 6]

Yeah being stripped away 3 weeks of 120-130 hour weekly pvp in decay hurts more than 2 week ban, even worse that he was going to hit R14 few hours after the ban.

[Papertank 0]

6 minutes ago, Overtime said:

Yeah being stripped away 3 weeks of 120-130 hour weekly pvp in decay hurts more than 2 week ban, even worse that he was going to hit R14 few hours after the ban.

#R14LIVESMATTER

[bryan8282 0]

free this man.AV leader,horde warrior,most of horde pvpers knows him and respect him .

 

Vurtneneb

[Gemt 1]

I dont know anything about Steves playing with the aledged chinese wintraders, but I know steve from premading with him during EU peaktimes for several weeks leading up to the ban. Steves primary playtimes were EU/US peaktimes, not chinese peaktimes, and he was not in risk of reaching the bracket caps. While he sometimes played with the chinese because there were no EU/US premades running at the time, I find it ridiculous to assume he would participate in the chinese premades if he thought there was any wintrading happening. He was one of the few players who actively managed and coordinated EU/US premades, and we never ever even considered wintrading. To then wintrade alone with the chinese during his last week of ranking, while not being at risk of reaching bracket cap, knowing there was an active witch hunt for wintraders happening, is unthinkable.

 

Edited March 8, 2017 by Gemt

[Ifrits 0]

I've been premading with steve since i was only rank 8, i've spent weeks with him and the other guys on discord, everyday for up to 18 hours each day.

Now i believe the ban itself was a HUGE overreaction by some GM, he maybe had games with guys who were later accused of win-trading, but most of us did too at some point in the period of time to r13/14, and we honestly had no idea of any suspicious activity going on with those guys.

 

Let's keep in mind that Wienersteve had its own premade (which i was included in, so i'm not talking of anything i'm not 100% sure of) for the most part of the day.

I don't believe the 2 weeks ban was needed in the first place, but seriously u cannot just ban hammer mindlessly a guy 2 HOURS before the honor reset (which would have granted him the rank 14), and then expect him to grind for 2 (or 3?) whole weeks 24/7 for the title he already gained in a LEGIT way.

 

Let's get this over with and grant him access to r14 weapons as it should be.

 

Ifrits

[hrisiqk 2]

2 hours ago, Ifrits said:

I've been premading with steve since i was only rank 8, i've spent weeks with him and the other guys on discord, everyday for up to 18 hours each day.

Now i believe the ban itself was a HUGE overreaction by some GM, he maybe had games with guys who were later accused of win-trading, but most of us did too at some point in the period of time to r13/14, and we honestly had no idea of any suspicious activity going on with those guys.

 

Let's keep in mind that Wienersteve had its own premade (which i was included in, so i'm not talking of anything i'm not 100% sure of) for the most part of the day.

I don't believe the 2 weeks ban was needed in the first place, but seriously u cannot just ban hammer mindlessly a guy 2 HOURS before the honor reset (which would have granted him the rank 14), and then expect him to grind for 2 (or 3?) whole weeks 24/7 for the title he already gained in a LEGIT way.

 

Let's get this over with and grant him access to r14 weapons as it should be.

 

Ifrits

^ nothing more to say that sums it up, that ban on wiener was absolutely malicious, redeem the JUSTICE please, I've ranked with him almost all of my higher ranks, and he cannot be accused in wintrading in no way, altho i have to say he had to appeal earlier even tho he was thinking his honor would be frozen or he'd get his last week honor distribution, but then again here we are.

GMs please look up to this, such acts of "justice" shoudn't be done unless u have very very very very very very solid evidence, I've seen plenty of unjustified bans lately of friends of mine or people I've played with, lets remember that those people put alot of effort and time into this game, lets not take that away just with 1 button ;)

Xleetigerq

[Jimmy 2]

I've been in a lot of BGs with Wienersteve and can honestly say I have absolutely no reason to believe he was wintrading. This seems like serious bullshit. It almost sounds like Wienersteve ganked  a GM or something and they got upset about it.

 

This is not a good look, Elysium, this is embarrassing.

[Hurricane2 2]

The only type of suspicious behavior you guys haven't addressed that could result in a ban is rolling over when you come across decent competition.  I don't know anything about this situation but the common theme I have seen in other people's ban appeals is that they did this and claimed it was ok to do since it wasn't pre planned even though they did it repeatedly.  You cant steamroll games and get steamrolled yourself on a consistent basis.  

Having said all that I don't know if that applies here.

[Wreklezz 0]

6 hours ago, bago said:

The amount of time, effort, and dedication required to pull rank 14 is not something to be underestimated. For someone like Steve, who contributes to the positive experience of many players on Anathema (Nostalrius), to not at least be shown clear and concise evidence of his intent to collude and subvert the honor system is unacceptable. 

 

Please review this case Elysium developers.

#R14LIVESMATTER

[Akuta 5]

Greetings Wienersteve,

 

Firstly I want to assure the entire community that we take banning people, even temporarily very seriously and we do not intend, nor stand behind bans that are done without evidence. 

Wienersteve, did you appeal your ban? I can see you had an issue in December that we helped you with, but nothing since then. If you had appealed your ban we would have taken a more detailed look and if there is no evidence we would have immediately unbanned you (as has been the case many times). If you did appeal could you DM me the details because I can't see it.

To all of the community - if you were banned and believe it was unreasonable we always recommend you appeal. The GM who reviews the appeal is always a different GM to the one that banned, and if there is no evidence provided we will overturn the Ban's. 

 

If you have any questions, or want to talk more your always welcome to reach out to us via in-game tickets.

 

The GM team.

[Udderownage 0]

I have played with and talked with Wienersteve over the past few months and there is no way this man is a win trader. This man played over 18 hours a day as he said for the one goal of hitting rank 14. At the same time he successfully lead a guild re-progressing through BWL. During the two weeks that he has been banned we have struggled to keep things going as a guild without him. This ban is not just an injustice to him, but to our entire guild and anyone who would seek to rank legitimately. If his only crime is playing with Chinese people who may or may not be rule breakers (many of whom were unbanned, so this is clearly not the case) then anyone on the server could be banned for the same logic just for playing the same game as them. This isn't justice, this is racism.

 If legitimate rankers get banned hours before receiving their justly earned rewards than what is the point of pvping on this server. Just to get rank 12-13 gear that gets nerfed terribly?

[IamScythed 0]

1 hour ago, Akuta said:

did you appeal your ban?

I don't think there is a chance of appealing to this kind of ban when you feel that the future of your character and the guild you're building is on risk.
From my own prospective, this almost felt like blackmail.

[Hurricane2 2]

1 hour ago, IamScythed said:

I don't think there is a chance of appealing to this kind of ban when you feel that the future of your character and the guild you're building is on risk.
From my own prospective, this almost felt like blackmail.

That is all the more reason to appeal.  You are assuming people that had temporary bans were converted to permanent bans because they appealed?

[wienersteve 0]

3 hours ago, Hurricane2 said:

That is all the more reason to appeal.  You are assuming people that had temporary bans were converted to permanent bans because they appealed?

Since I was threatened with a permanent ban, and really was just on the defensive from the first word of my conversation with the GM, I decided not to pursue it at the time since I believed I would still get what I had earned.  I of course made a mistake not appealing it immediately, but, to my knowledge, I was one of the only people in this wave of bans that was given the opportunity to talk to a GM at all, and wrongfully assumed that the GM team had most likely talked about this and decided to just take my 2 weeks, get my weapons when i got back, (since i was stacked at cap and my standing remained empty that week) and leave it be.

[Hurricane2 2]

Still doesn't make sense to me.  The worst thing that can happen when you appeal is that the appeal is denied and the punishment remains the same.

[milz 0]

From the ban wave that happened weeks ago, Steve got the worst of it for absolutely no reason. I played many premade games with steve and the chinease rankers late NA timezone and we ALWAYS put 100% effort into WINNING every game. Im not sure what other evidence you used to merrit a temp ban on his account but i as well as others who were in the only posted screenshot of the alleged wintrading NEVER played battlegrounds with the intent to wintrade for quick easy honor. 

[Hurricane2 2]

Premeditation is irrelevant.  However you stated you went 100% every game so you should have nothing to worry about.

[Lame 1]

I've been playing against Winer since forever,he and his premade are legit I can assure.

 

I even may have video recording of their plays if they can help make him unban