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Anathema's only population fix

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On 7/21/2017 at 0:32 PM, foleet said:

Well if you don't care about your gear, the easy solution is to re-roll on Elysium. It takes ~ 1 month to hit 60, then you got a character that you can experience a high pop realm with. If you're not willing to level for one month, sounds like a high pop isn't a priority for you. 

 

 

 

How is this a solution to the problem? It isn't. They might as well shut down Anathema altogether if this is the only way around the population issue.

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2 hours ago, Phoosy said:

The Open Source devs working on Naxx are not developers who are working on the team. They're all dedicated to doing Naxx for their own reasons. There's no resource loss for attention being given to Naxx other than sysadmin tasks that take very little time.

LOL! We had the 1.10 patch delayed 3 times for over three weeks because of naxx ptr. Don't tell me that naxx isn't taking elysium devs time. If you actually thought about it you'd realize the resources that are being used for something like that. Please.

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43 minutes ago, taladril said:

LOL! We had the 1.10 patch delayed 3 times for over three weeks because of naxx ptr. Don't tell me that naxx isn't taking elysium devs time. If you actually thought about it you'd realize the resources that are being used for something like that. Please.

I was literally on the team and know exactly what resources are being used where. Naxx, nor any "future" content are what's preventing this from occurring. Perhaps I'm not the one who needs to 'think'.

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Umm when a ptr comes out for testing and an official patch gets delayed then yes it is quite clear what the priorities are regardless of your insiderness level. Unless you'd like to explain this unique situation where magically it doesn't take staff to spin up hardware, make gms and devs available for patches, monitoring, and crashes, and more?

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Sometimes, it helps to analyse other projects to determine the impact of actions.

Creating new servers, merging servers and going to new expansions has all been done on Feenix. This video summarizes it to the point:

 

That doesn't mean that a merge wouldn't be a good solution. It's just important to notice that a lot of things can go wrong and the goal is to prevent that.

 

My thesis: At the moment you have 3 servers with different progression status and that is comparable to 3 servers with different expansions. Nobody would argue that merging a vanilla, a tbc and a wotlk server would be a good idea. But why do so many people want a merge of anathema, elysium (and even darrowshire, some ask for that)?

My guess for the best solution: Wait until all realms are at the same point of progression and then merge them. That point will happen naturally after Naxx is released on Elysium at last or it can be forced before. You could stop progression on Anathema and merge it after Elysium reaches 1.10. But solutions that try to reverse anything achieved on Anathema sound tremendously complicated and unrealistic.

There is still the question if Darrowshire should stay seperated due to the PvE status. I left the server a while ago, but I can observe the numbers during the course of a day and they are only a shadow of the past. There is a solution, which is custom and not blizzlike. But since there are so many custom changes already, why not do that one. Back to Basics, a german tbc realm, uses a system called PvX which forces your to pick PvE or PvP for your account and then play with that - all on the same realm. Wouldn't that be awesome? One big realm that makes everyone happy in the end? :p

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1 hour ago, Toradh said:

You have quite literally no idea what you are saying. It's obvious. I'm sorry but have you ever worked on a project like this? You have absolutely no idea what goes on behind the scenes. None whatsoever.

lol

I've read this sentence over and over and I just can't make sense of it.

Hard disk drives have to spin in order for the contents of the disks to be read; GM means Game Master; Devs means Developers; Patches are sets of data used to update a program, for example, to fix bugs (look that up yourself) in WoW code. Monitoring is the same as you looking at your computer monitor. You're monitoring it. Crashes occur when a code problem fuck's shit up to the point that the server has to reset itself.

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Anyone want to bet me when arguing here that those that are poo pooing any merge idea actually don't play on anathema? Of course you don't see the urgency when your server is doing just fine. 1k online is only a number. Only a number to you. To us who live it it means dying guilds and lack of competition guild wise and player poaching to the extreme.

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Sadly I doubt anything will ever be done.  Or, if something is done it will be too late. I have an 8/8 shaman with near full BWL bis on darrowshire, and stopped playing because it was obvious the staff was not putting the same effort they put into the other realms.  ZG managed to keep the pop at a somewhat playable level for a month or two, but was also full of bugs that took ages to fix. In addition to that, horde population is absolutely abysmal, creating a near-unplayable environment. The gap is only widening too, it is now something absurd like a 3:1 ally/horde ratio.  The staff have not acknowledged this issue once, to my knowledge.

 Additionally, I played on Kronos 1 during the nost shutdown and can see almost the exact same thing happening with anathema... new server bleeds population out of the progressed server, until the original is a ghost town.  At this point, an open discussion with the staff about working towards a merge would be the only thing to get me (and many others i know who quit ana/darrow) to play again. 

Staff of Elysium, please consider at least HAVING this discussion with your player base, and before it is too late.  There is still time, you can learn from the mistakes of Feenix and Kronos.

Regards,

Stormfront

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25 minutes ago, Stormfront said:

Sadly I doubt anything will ever be done.  Or, if something is done it will be too late. I have an 8/8 shaman with near full BWL bis on darrowshire, and stopped playing because it was obvious the staff was not putting the same effort they put into the other realms.  ZG managed to keep the pop at a somewhat playable level for a month or two, but was also full of bugs that took ages to fix. In addition to that, horde population is absolutely abysmal, creating a near-unplayable environment. The gap is only widening too, it is now something absurd like a 3:1 ally/horde ratio.  The staff have not acknowledged this issue once, to my knowledge.

 Additionally, I played on Kronos 1 during the nost shutdown and can see almost the exact same thing happening with anathema... new server bleeds population out of the progressed server, until the original is a ghost town.  At this point, an open discussion with the staff about working towards a merge would be the only thing to get me (and many others i know who quit ana/darrow) to play again. 

Staff of Elysium, please consider at least HAVING this discussion with your player base, and before it is too late.  There is still time, you can learn from the mistakes of Feenix and Kronos.

Regards,

Stormfront

Totally agreed. Also in Darrowshire too.

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Merging the servers sure as hell would it make easier for the Devs in the long run.

As far as I can tell, there are still problems with 1.10 on Ana and on Darrowshire some stuff from 1.7, which was released in April (!), is still not implemented (like the +Defense nerf to pre-Raid-Items). I guess this is because the Devs have to split their time between these multiple realms, that are all on different patches and have different problems. A single realm would eliminate this problem.

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merging with elysium is also quite problematic considering the servers performance. atm we have 8,5k players on weekends, which results in huge lags.

 

they are already asking for donations to fix this.

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Just think of the money they could save by letting go of hosting 2 dead realms. Use that money to upgrade Elysium.

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3 hours ago, mbd said:

Just think of the money they could save by letting go of hosting 2 dead realms. Use that money to upgrade Elysium.

The two "dead" servers are payed for by the players that play on them, because they love their server. Ruining their server wont bring in any extra money since these people would either stop playing / donating.

 

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As can be seen by most of these comments and talking to the majority of the communities on the realms, no, not many would stop playing, and a LOT would come back. More donatins, 2 less realms to pay for, profit?!?

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23 minutes ago, mbd said:

As can be seen by most of these comments and talking to the majority of the communities on the realms, no, not many would stop playing, and a LOT would come back. More donatins, 2 less realms to pay for, profit?!?

The Anathema/Darrowshire players donated the majority of their money directly for hosting of their own server. Donate your money for Elysium if you want better hardware on your server.

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I would love to transfer my main from Elysium (stopped playing due to overcrowded pop) to Anathema and help with the population. Sadly the team has a zero tolerance policy when it comes to transfers.

Anathema and Darrowshire might end up like Zeth'Kur eventually.

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4 hours ago, mbd said:

As can be seen by most of these comments and talking to the majority of the communities on the realms, no, not many would stop playing, and a LOT would come back. More donatins, 2 less realms to pay for, profit?!?

"The majority of the community" by that you mean the loud guys who create threads all over the place cause they got kicked or their guild disbanded and cant find a new one cause everyone else on their server find them obnoxious? Or people who simply refuse to join a guild? Yes, anathema and darrowshire is awfull for those kinds of people.

And you are making some really big assumptions when you say more people will return than those who leave.

Ever considered what would happen to people on darrow and anathema if their servers got merged with elysium? 

Option 1: they get downgraded to elysium patch and all the gear they have spendt tons of hours farming will be removed or temporary disabled for months. Making it completely pointless to play at all.

Option 2: wait for elysium to catch up with the servers before releasing any new content. Farming bwl / AQ for another year is sure to bring a lot of people back. content draughts always worked out for blizzard right?

Option 3: speed up content on elysium to faster match the other 2 servers, while still releasing content on the other 2 servers. Thats probably the best option, and time it so that elysium and darrowshire gets naxx at the same time, and merge the servers like a month after naxx release to give both servers a fair competition in server firsts. (This will do nothing for anathema since they are supposed to get naxx in a few months)

Option 4: do nothing at all and merge servers a good while after naxx has been cleared on all servers.

 

None of those options are optimal, you are gonna piss of a large portion of a server no matter what you do.

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14 minutes ago, Roxy said:

"The majority of the community" by that you mean the loud guys who create threads all over the place cause they got kicked or their guild disbanded and cant find a new one cause everyone else on their server find them obnoxious? Or people who simply refuse to join a guild? Yes, anathema and darrowshire is awfull for those kinds of people.

Never seen such a heap of rubbish conjested into a single paragraph. You either don't play on Anathema, or if you do you play with your eyes wide shut in denial to the ongoing issues. There are indeed a lot of people who are in favour of it.

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I don't understand why people want to go back to BWL patch when they farmed it for over a year while waiting for AQ...

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4 hours ago, Roxy said:

Ever considered what would happen to people on darrow and anathema if their servers got merged with elysium? 

If the staff acknowledged us like they did with zeth, maybe there could be a poll of some sort to see how many are in favor or against making some sort of action? (what said action would be is an entirely different debate)  On kronos' forums there was a very loud vocal minority against a merge of any kind, and put the staff off from trying anything for a while.  Until there was an actual poll made that had majority in support of a merge, despite the servers being on different stages of progression. Now, months later they are much better off for it, low pop but still alive despite Elysiums popularity. I hardly think its fair to call us an obnoxious, loud minority, when there has been no polling done to see how many are actually in favor of this. Otherwise, how can you say "the people dont want this" without any real numbers?

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5 hours ago, mbd said:

Never seen such a heap of rubbish conjested into a single paragraph. You either don't play on Anathema, or if you do you play with your eyes wide shut in denial to the ongoing issues. There are indeed a lot of people who are in favour of it.

Never said i did, nor did i say there arent people in favor of it.

1 hour ago, Stormfront said:

If the staff acknowledged us like they did with zeth, maybe there could be a poll of some sort to see how many are in favor or against making some sort of action? (what said action would be is an entirely different debate)  On kronos' forums there was a very loud vocal minority against a merge of any kind, and put the staff off from trying anything for a while.  Until there was an actual poll made that had majority in support of a merge, despite the servers being on different stages of progression. Now, months later they are much better off for it, low pop but still alive despite Elysiums popularity. I hardly think its fair to call us an obnoxious, loud minority, when there has been no polling done to see how many are actually in favor of this. Otherwise, how can you say "the people dont want this" without any real numbers?

Never once did i say anything that any majority were leading any way in this matter, and if you actually bothered to read my post, the entire first part of it was about how the guy i replied to were calling himself "the voice of the majority" but i guess people in favor of a merge is allowed to say whatever they want cause they want the same as you do? 

Instead of making counter arguments about things we cannot possible know, how about you comment on the several consequenses if a merge were to happen that i wrote?

 

And about the obnoxious part, that was aimed at the guy Dizeliun who kept making these kinds of threads, and when people didnt agree with him he spammed forums with server dead memes for a week.

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The players that want to abandon Anathema or force a merge with Elysium can be estimated by the number of people making posts about it, give a factor of 10 for silent agreement, nets you about 100-150 players. That is NOT the majority of Anathema. It's maybe 10%. The active population of Anathema is higher than the peak population, btw. 

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14 minutes ago, Roxy said:

Never said i did, nor did i say there arent people in favor of it.

Never once did i say anything that any majority were leading any way in this matter, and if you actually bothered to read my post, the entire first part of it was about how the guy i replied to were calling himself "the voice of the majority" but i guess people in favor of a merge is allowed to say whatever they want cause they want the same as you do? 

Instead of making counter arguments about things we cannot possible know, how about you comment on the several consequenses if a merge were to happen that i wrote?

 

And about the obnoxious part, that was aimed at the guy Dizeliun who kept making these kinds of threads, and when people didnt agree with him he spammed forums with server dead memes for a week.

Yes, the person you quoted made an assumption in saying it was the majority. After all, this entire thread is just baseless speculation anyway (see Stodola's magic math numbers) so the point i'm trying to make is that a poll is necessary to gauge people's interest or disinterest in the idea of a merge.  I believe how the merge would be executed is an entirely different debate for another time, and yes every course of action will make some people unhappy and have consequences, including leaving things the way the are.  

So my suggestion to the Elysium staff would be to make poll, not just on the forums where it falls on deaf ears.  There could in-game messages, reminders on discord, etc.  Give people a solid few weeks for those wanting to think it over.  This is by no means a perfect solution, but at least we would have a general number to work with and go from there. 

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http://vanillaradar.com/elysium-stats/darrowshire/

"All Time" gives a good impression of the current trend of population. Numbers are not 100% accurate, but they indeed show what people worry about. Population for Elysium is growing and for Darrowshire/Anathema it is decreasing. That is not a problem now - many people are totally fine with their server size. I played for years on therebirth which had ~300 players online most of the time and I was ok with that. But will this trend just continue? Or can it be stopped? It is a tricky situation for your project... I hope we are all on the same side regarding that point :p

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37 minutes ago, Stormfront said:

Yes, the person you quoted made an assumption in saying it was the majority. After all, this entire thread is just baseless speculation anyway (see Stodola's magic math numbers) so the point i'm trying to make is that a poll is necessary to gauge people's interest or disinterest in the idea of a merge.  I believe how the merge would be executed is an entirely different debate for another time, and yes every course of action will make some people unhappy and have consequences, including leaving things the way the are.  

So my suggestion to the Elysium staff would be to make poll, not just on the forums where it falls on deaf ears.  There could in-game messages, reminders on discord, etc.  Give people a solid few weeks for those wanting to think it over.  This is by no means a perfect solution, but at least we would have a general number to work with and go from there. 

Polls are no good either, unless you are able to restrict who can vote to anathema /darrowshire players with a active character above lvl 40ish.

A normal poll does not attract the majority, but it does attract trolls if there are no restrictions.

Elysium players thats happy to see the other servers burn will flock to these polls just to tear down the nostalrius legacy.

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