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Shedur

Upgraded Blue PvP Set on Elysium

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Oh they are totally invested in increasing pvp activity. But it's increasing PvP by the masses, not the premade community. The premade culture on private servers has completely annihilated casual pvp, leading to overall decreased participation in BGs. They are monitoring pvp participation on Anathema to see if their 3 person max thing works because lets be real, Anathema is the PTR for Elysium. If participation increases, then I expect Elysium to get the same change.

Jerome you are such a cancer player, NO REASON TO PVP BECAUSE MAH ITEMS? I guess pvp isn't fun for you, get the hell out of pvp then.

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@Haestingas I feel like you're fighting both sides of the argument.

 "Oh they are totally invested in increasing pvp activity. But it's increasing PvP by the masses, not the premade community."

"Jerome you are such a cancer player, NO REASON TO PVP BECAUSE MAH ITEMS?"

I just would have though you would have been be happy with a little of both worlds. Force people into the 3 man groups while giving them gear to play for.

Do you think destroying premades alone would be enough to encourage pvp? I understand the thought process behind the respec cut, but breaking premades only forces them to queue differently, it doesn't bring in a flood of people.

Again, there is a 6 Month (At least) content drought after ZG is released, a time where this PvP gear is for the most part on par with other gear. Would this not be the best time into incentivize it? 

Adding another avenue for people to gear up before AQ comes out is such a good way to keep people invested in Elysium, you want to give people as many avenues to gear up as possible so they don't feel like joining the server so late is TOO late.

 

I think overall we're on the same page, what can we do to increase PvP activity? I would be interested to hear your thoughts on this Haestingas.

 

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18 hours ago, jerome said:

Yeah my Poll with nearly 85% in favor of out of over 250+ votes, and had over 4000 views in 3 days was locked after Whitekidney said it wasn't going to happen. PvP will be basically dead before AQ comes out at this rate. No reason to PvP outside of weapons, and nearly 99% cant play that much, GG elysium. Hopefully you'll open your eyes before it's too late.

How would upgrading pvp gear now have any impact on pvp being alive or dead when AQ comes out.  I mean regardless of if they update the gear now or later no one is going to rank for the armor if they can do AQ and get t2.5 way easier so I don't see why you think upgrading pvp now is going to help pvp when AQ comes out.  I don't agree with your thought process either.  I think a majority of people who queue for BGs do it because they actually like doing BGs, sure they don't do BGs 16 hours a day but I don't think you need a select group of people doing BGs 16 hours a day to have an active pvp community.  Truthfully if they really want to increase pvp activity when AQ/Naxx come out on Elysium they should reduce the respec cost even further, maybe even Kronos style 5g.  Raiders just aren't going to pvp that much when there's a cost associated with it.

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 @quasexort Your argument stating "How would upgrading pvp gear now have any impact on pvp being alive or dead when AQ comes out." followed by "...no one is going to rank for the armor if they can do AQ and get t2.5 way easier...", that is like saying no one is going to raid Molten Core because Naxxramas is coming out. You are absolutely on the money though when you said no one will rank when AQ is out, that is the "Dead" PvP reality.

 

The argument people are making is to give the upgraded PvP gear while it is semi competitive, otherwise it will always be junk. The type of people on this server for the most part are Min/Maxers, some willing to go further than others. The situation Jerome is talking about is this: You start on a Fresh server and you need to get Pre-BiS ready, Molten Core comes out and you have to get BWL Ready, BWL comes out and you have to get AQ Ready, ZG comes out to fill in those niche gear pieces you want for AQ .... now wait 6-8 months with no reason to log in (other than to raid log), AQ comes out got to get ready for Naxx, Then Naxx and PVP gear updates(which are MC quality mostly). People don't want MC loot level gear when they are raiding Naxx.

 

Jerome is arguing people will get what they need out of ZG quickly and then go back to raid logging during that 6-8 month content drought, but PVP being time gated (meaning you can only get so far in a week), would get more people who Min/Max involved in PvP over those months. Also, having that PvP available during 1.7 would make the Dragons of Nightmare patch (1.8) so much more exciting because people would be ready for battle! The skills people gain from actively doing battlegrounds is good for the community!

 

I personally think they want to go into PvP now, regardless of updated gear, but the PVP culture right now is extremely hostile. Only by incentivizing PvP with reasonable gear will there be enough players simultaneously joining into battlegrounds to cause a PvP boom in our community.

 

Edited by Swiftdeus
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I don’t see how you can compare going for rank 13 when AQ is out to doing MC when AQ is out.  Plenty of new players will do MC even when AQ is out but the only people who would even consider going for rank 13 are hardcore players.  Hardcore players are extremely likely to be in a guild that can do AQ so there’s really no reason to go for rank 13 if you can get t2.5 which is my point. You guys believe the only way to make pvp alive and active is to give gear incentives but those incentives don’t really matter when AQ comes out so in your eyes pvp dies with AQ regardless of whether or not they update the gear.

Like I said above, if you want an active community to pvp all you really have to do is get rid of the gate between pvp and pve which is the gold you have to spend to respec.  If they made respecs 5g then anyone who wants to pvp for fun after raiding can easily afford to do it and now you have your active pvp community.  I think a large portion of the community actually enjoy doing BGs with or without the gear incentive it’s just a majority of the people who are level 60 raid.  The only way you can raid and pvp is by spending gold to respec and a lot of people just don’t want to spend gold to do it so they just don’t pvp that much.

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@Quasexort,

I never said people wouldn't do MC when AQ is out. " that is like saying no one is going to raid Molten Core because Naxxramas is coming out", essentially was saying that there will always be better gear that will be released next patch, that doesn't mean you don't collect the best gear available to you right now.  Yes, obviously Molten Core is going no where.

When you say "I don’t see how you can compare going for rank 13 when AQ is out to doing MC when AQ is out.", I believe the forum topic is to upgrade the blue gear (although I do admit it would be kind of awkward if the blue gear was better than the epic gear). 

I agree that PvP may die down as of the AQ release, but that wont stop people from getting their alts into BGs for Gear and Mounts, especially the raid loggers. I think by saying "You guys believe the only way to make pvp alive and active is to give gear incentives but those incentives don’t really matter when AQ comes out so in your eyes pvp dies with AQ regardless of whether or not they update the gear.", you have skipped the entire argument. It is like saying you wont do dungeons when AQ is out. That may or may not be the case.

As for your comment on decreasing the respec cost, I don't know that I necessarily disagree. It could make pvp more viable for some, it wouldn't inflate the economy that much, it would really make Elysium shy away from blizzlike... but it already has so... I'd be okay with a test period on this.

@Quasexort, You are absolutely right, we don't know if adding PvP gear will make the PvP scene better on Elysium. When it was implemented on Nostralius early it increased the amount of people PvPing substantially and people agreed it was a good change. That aside, if not now when? Between 1.6-1.9 Is the only reasonable time to make this change, otherwise Elysium misses out on this opportunity.

Edited by Swiftdeus
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All I play for is PvP, yet the gear I get for hard work isn't even worth it. I want to play, but right now its actually pointless because there is no reward for it. I want to PvP, but my gear is still what I found leveling with some weak blues I got from ranking, I'm incredibly undergeared and even if I rank higher, I will still be undergeared, and being undergeared in PvP is really not fun, so now I don't want to PvP, but I do want to. It's just not fun nor rewarding.

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R10 upgraded gear would increase PVP activity among non-hardcore rankers, which in turn would make it easier for R14 pushers to achieve their goal. Enabling it would not break PVE in any way, as it's inferior to most raid gear available now. Definitely no harm done if something like this happens.

Edited by Maric

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This is by far the most requested change on this server. Just arrange the suggestion forum by replies and its the 5 of the top 10 things listed! Listen to your player base. Do not miss out on this opportunity! 

Edited by Swiftdeus

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5 hours ago, Swiftdeus said:

This is by far the most requested change on this server. Just arrange the suggestion forum by replies and its the 5 of the top 10 things listed! Listen to your player base. Do not miss out on this opportunity! 

Problem is they don't care about you.

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@donkey

Just saw patch notes about expired mail... no more "Mark Bombing". That's a non blizzlike change that is good for the community, pretty much aligns with this change to make PvP gear again.

Edited by Swiftdeus

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1 hour ago, Swiftdeus said:

@donkey

Just saw patch notes about expired mail... no more "Mark Bombing". That's a non blizzlike change that is good for the community, pretty much aligns with this change to make PvP gear again.

It was a bug to begin with, marks - as did all mail did actually expire in retail. Nothing to do with a 'non-blizzlike' change.

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22 hours ago, Swiftdeus said:

@donkey

Just saw patch notes about expired mail... no more "Mark Bombing". That's a non blizzlike change that is good for the community, pretty much aligns with this change to make PvP gear again.

Marks not expiring was a non-blizzlike bug. Imo it is now blizzlike, kudos to elysium for finally fixing it.

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Marks lasted 30 days on retail, that is Blizzlike. Elysium reduced the duration mail would stay in you mailbox (Non-Blizzlike / GOOD CHANGE), but it was bugged so marks would still stay in you mail for 30 days (So Blizzlike). Now Elysium has fixed their bug and marks only stay a short period in the mailbox as designed (Non-Blizzlike / GOOD CHANGE).

The argument is, if we can stray away from Blizzlike with bosses, talents, farming spots, mailbox, why do we have to keep the gear HORRIBLE? And I mean really horrible for anyone time investment for pvp; you can get full pre-bis in a week in dungeons... but after a month of PvP you have nothing to show for it. The gear is worse in most cases than the dungeon gear you can aquire so quickly. The updated gear can be on par with MC gear, more or less, but it completely time gated so people can't just pick up 5 friends play for an hour and get gear. I don't see the reasoning of the Elysium Staff to not make this change when it has so many positive things associated with it, honestly I don't see any negatives because a perfectly Blizzlike is non-realistic, make this change so people actually PvP on your server, not the account sellers.

 

Edited by Swiftdeus
Editing / Spelling / Grammar

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On 5.10.2017 at 3:47 PM, Swiftdeus said:

Marks lasted 30 days on retail, that is Blizzlike. Elysium reduced the duration mail would stay in you mailbox (Non-Blizzlike / GOOD CHANGE), but it was bugged so marks would still stay in you mail for 30 days (So Blizzlike). Now Elysium has fixed their bug and marks only stay a short period in the mailbox as designed (Non-Blizzlike / GOOD CHANGE).

The argument is, if we can stray away from Blizzlike with bosses, talents, farming spots, mailbox, why do we have to keep the gear HORRIBLE? And I mean really horrible for anyone time investment for pvp; you can get full pre-bis in a week in dungeons... but after a month of PvP you have nothing to show for it. The gear is worse in most cases than the dungeon gear you can aquire so quickly. The updated gear can be on par with MC gear, more or less, but it completely time gated so people can't just pick up 5 friends play for an hour and get gear. I don't see the reasoning of the Elysium Staff to not make this change when it has so many positive things associated with it, honestly I don't see any negatives because a perfectly Blizzlike is non-realistic, make this change so people actually PvP on your server, not the account sellers.

 

the devs know it - they just dont give a fuck

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Elysium Devs/team-

You have the ability to be better than Blizz and make changes for the better of the community. You do care about PvP as displayed by reducing respec cost, and by testing out 3 man PvP caps. It is clear you want more people to PvP, and better quality PvP.  The question then becomes do you believe that by waiting to upgrade the Blue PvP set that you are helping the PvP community? No action is a decision, just as much as actually changing something. Please respond with your rationale for why waiting to release the upgrade is better for the PvP community. 

Much like many here, I believe that releasing the upgrade blue PvP gear will provide additional incentive for more people to PvP. As it stands now the set is very low power, and generally not worth the effort. By upgrading the set now, you can have a better timing than blizzard and have the reward for ranking actually be a reward worth while.

Thank you for this amazing server, I appreciate all of your hard work and effort. Any feed back from the Elysium team would be greatly appreciated. 

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I'm quitting if it's not done, really no point in playing. Queues are horrible, what am I even ranking for.... nothing.. i hate pve and I don't want to be a raid logger.

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16 hours ago, foleet said:

Elysium Devs/team-

You have the ability to be better than Blizz and make changes for the better of the community. You do care about PvP as displayed by reducing respec cost, and by testing out 3 man PvP caps. It is clear you want more people to PvP, and better quality PvP.  The question then becomes do you believe that by waiting to upgrade the Blue PvP set that you are helping the PvP community? No action is a decision, just as much as actually changing something. Please respond with your rationale for why waiting to release the upgrade is better for the PvP community. 

Much like many here, I believe that releasing the upgrade blue PvP gear will provide additional incentive for more people to PvP. As it stands now the set is very low power, and generally not worth the effort. By upgrading the set now, you can have a better timing than blizzard and have the reward for ranking actually be a reward worth while.

Thank you for this amazing server, I appreciate all of your hard work and effort. Any feed back from the Elysium team would be greatly appreciated. 

bump! 

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I was sad when they first announced to not give the updated set before aq, because my incentive to play warrior was to do pvp and get to rank 10 on this server so i could have some fun pvp'ing and get a reasonable set to mix with some dungeon gear to do some raids for fun / have gear that lasts a bit longer than pre 60 leveling gear. After the announcement came i was already on the grind somehow and didnt want to stop.

I personaly wouldnt grind to r10 again when the set comes available, be that planned with aq (obv too late to be worth going for) or even now with zg.

For people who start pvping here this might be a nice change and with zg the set items for casters are kinda on par, so the pvp set is not overpowered.

For now im using my gear for style, because lets be honest its good for nothing else. 

Nosts approach was loved by many and hated by some (because they didnt upgrade the r13 set at the same time, the blue set was better).

So updating the blue and epic set at the same time should be the right and only choice, and for that i must say zg might be too soon.

signing out with an unclear oppinion. 

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