Basic Questions on Lock and Mage

[meddlingmage 3]

I was almost set on choosing a warlock to level with the fresh server launch (Nost 2.0/Elysium PvP) but the more I hear about their endgame and what they are (supposedly?) expected to do... they almost sound more like a hybrid/support which is not a role I want to fill.

So for an example whats the deal with the shards? Am I really going to be expected (in terms of being "raid ready") to craft 40 healthstones for everyone in the raid? How about summoning? It also costs a shard to summon the rest of the raid members, am I expected to do this? Assuming I'll be one of the first people at the raid, because guess what? I've been crafting healthstones.

 

What about curses? For example I've heard a lot of locks may be expected to essentially make the tank and/or mages better. Curse of elements (reducing mobs resistance to frost/fire or something along those lines right?) So instead of using my own DPS spells am I going to be expected to do nothing but buffing/banishing or what?

 

I just don't want to spend countless hours leveling only to reach raid readyness and be expected to debuff (curse) mobs and buff other classes. I hope this all makes sense. I would also like to note I don't have interest in PvP, strictly talking group content here. Are locks ignored by healers in general? In terms of life tapping themselves and then exhausting their HP and eventually running out of DPS essentially?

I guess (along with answering the questions above) I'd like to know what my expectations are at end game as a level 60 lock, it sounds like I don't exactly focus on DPS but instead a ton of utility and buffing others? It sounds like a heavy load to take with a lot of skill required. If I want to focus on pure DPS would I be looking more into a mage class? 

 

Really any contributions and basic comparisons/contrasts of what I can expect with a mage versus a lock would be fantastic. What can I expect my role for each to be in raids? What are the differences? Any personal experiences more than welcome!

Edited November 15, 2016 by meddlingmage

[фткyн 1469]

I was almost set on choosing a warlock to level with the fresh server launch (Nost 2.0/Elysium PvP) but the more I hear about their endgame and what they are (supposedly?) expected to do... they almost sound more like a hybrid/support which is not a role I want to fill.

So for an example whats the deal with the shards? Am I really going to be expected (in terms of being "raid ready") to craft 40 healthstones for everyone in the raid? How about summoning? It also costs a shard to summon the rest of the raid members, am I expected to do this? Assuming I'll be one of the first people at the raid, because guess what? I've been crafting healthstones.

Nop, mostly ppl dont pick your healthstones, but you must use your ss spell by cooldown.

 

What about curses? For example I've heard a lot of locks may be expected to essentially make the tank and/or mages better. Curse of elements (reducing mobs resistance to frost/fire or something along those lines right?) So instead of using my own DPS spells am I going to be expected to do nothing but buffing/banishing or what?

Yes, firstly you will must cast curse, coe/cos/cor and yes, you will banish anything.

Healers will heal you when you tapping, but you are is last prio so keep its in mind.

 

As a mage you will buffing, polymorphing, portaling, making food/water

 

So, noone pure dps in this game, even fury warriors tank somtimes, even rogues sap and disarm traps sometimes.

Edited November 15, 2016 by фткyн

[slippery 4]

you can probably expect to summon 1-5 people per raid max

possibly even less

ive never been given a healthstone by a warlock in any raid, ever

you'll probably want to make yourself a healthstone and maybe the tank but i doubt even that

 

yea, ur going to be assigned a curse, might be shadows might be elements or recklessness

 

you will curse whatever but some1 else will be cursing shadow for you

 

warlock in pve is curse your curse if you are assigned > shadow bolt

[meddlingmage 3]

Nop, mostly ppl dont pick your healthstones, but you must use your ss spell by cooldown.

 

Yes, firstly you will must cast curse, coe/cos/cor and yes, you will banish anything.

Healers will heal you when you tapping, but you are is last prio so keep its in mind.

 

As a mage you will buffing, polymorphing, portaling, making food/water

 

So, noone pure dps in this game, even fury warriors tank somtimes, even rogues sap and disarm traps sometimes.

Could you please explain what "but you must use your ss spell by cooldown" means? I'm not very familiar with the spells yet.

I also do not know what "coe/cos/cor" stand for, my apologies. How often is banish off cooldown?

 

Could you please explain the mage "buffs"

[Method 0]

Could you please explain what "but you must use your ss spell by cooldown" means? I'm not very familiar with the spells yet.

I also do not know what "coe/cos/cor" stand for, my apologies. How often is banish off cooldown?

 

Could you please explain the mage "buffs"

if you want the break the dps recount while you do nothing more warlock is not your class, pick rogue

[Pottu 290]

Curse of Elements, Curse of Shadows, Curse of Recklessness. SS is soul stone and it should be kept up at all times on a priest as wipe protection. Paladins can bubble, shamans can reincarnate and druids should not waste their battle ress to recover from a wipe. Banish is only used when the RL calls for it, though you'll quickly learn in which encounters its used. As stated, you will have to summon at least few people each raid and other raiders might ask you for health stones - it's also basic etiquette to offer them if you're a lock. No, you don't have to make 40 of them, because you won't be the only lock there and healers usually don't need them, though there are times when they do.

 

Mages will buff Arcane Intellect on all mana using classes. Since there are usually more than 1 mage, they will divide the raid groups between themselves. The buff lasts 30 or 60 minutes, so it's not something you have to constantly cast. In addition to that, mages will conjure food and water for the raid and, once an instance is cleared or the RL calls it for the night, create portals to the capitals. In some encounters, mages will focus on sheeping specific mobs or decursing the raid instead of focusing on dealing damage.

[Drain 19]

If you want ranged without hardly any busy work, why not just roll a Hunter? This is an easymode class at 41y, which barely has any competition for slots or gear. You stand out of range of most AOEs, and have no busy work except clicking trueshot every 30m. The aspect lasts until death, and you can avoid most repair bills with FD. The only drawback is ammo, but you can make your own rounds with engineering, or with a character has it. If your Hunter is not an Engineer, simply level an alt with it, and use him to farm/craft bullets. Suckers bought the AV rounds, which costed more than the thorium rounds, yet did less DPS. The ammo you want is on engineering, and using it in bulk demands that you make it yourself, vs getting ripped at the auctions.

[Zappa 7]

If you really want to be the pure dps-player with no real duties i´d suggest rolling a rogue.

There is only one small part in BWL where you got a job to do and the rest of the day you

will be just doing damage without having to care for your entire raid.

No buffs, stones, summons, etc. .

As Drain said, hunter is comparable but at least you got your part in the tranq shot rotation.

[meddlingmage 3]

If you really want to be the pure dps-player with no real duties i´d suggest rolling a rogue.

There is only one small part in BWL where you got a job to do and the rest of the day you

will be just doing damage without having to care for your entire raid.

No buffs, stones, summons, etc. .

As Drain said, hunter is comparable but at least you got your part in the tranq shot rotation.

That doesn't exactly sound appealing to me, its not that I don't want any responsibility I guess it just sounds more daunting than it probably really is. Its hard to understand all of the ins/outs of a class you've never played and have zero experience with you know? I still like the appeal of a Lock I just have no experience to fall back on you know?

[Zappa 7]

That doesn't exactly sound appealing to me, its not that I don't want any responsibility I guess it just sounds more daunting than it probably really is. Its hard to understand all of the ins/outs of a class you've never played and have zero experience with you know? I still like the appeal of a Lock I just have no experience to fall back on you know?

I came up with the rogue thing because you said:

 

"I just don't want to spend countless hours leveling only to reach raid readyness and be expected to debuff (curse) mobs and buff other classes."

 

That is exactly what Warlocks and Mages partially do: Summoning, conjuring, cursing, buffing, debuffing...aso

But most of the time it´s just spamming frost- and shadowbolts.

 

So if you want pure dps - little responsibility - go rogue or hunter.

If you want more responsibility go mage or even more than that go warlock.

Edited November 15, 2016 by Zappa

[houdre 0]

If you want ranged without hardly any busy work, why not just roll a Hunter? This is an easymode class at 41y, which barely has any competition for slots or gear. You stand out of range of most AOEs, and have no busy work except clicking trueshot every 30m. The aspect lasts until death, and you can avoid most repair bills with FD. The only drawback is ammo, but you can make your own rounds with engineering, or with a character has it. If your Hunter is not an Engineer, simply level an alt with it, and use him to farm/craft bullets. Suckers bought the AV rounds, which costed more than the thorium rounds, yet did less DPS. The ammo you want is on engineering, and using it in bulk demands that you make it yourself, vs getting ripped at the auctions.

 

I have to disagree with quite some points of this post... As hunter might seem "easymode" class, I can guarantee it's not the case, except if you're baddie hunter like ~80% of hunters at 60. By baddie I mean not using your class to it's maximum potential.

 

As I can agree with some huge advantages as:

- 41yds range which gives you lots of mobility in boss encounters such as for example outranging of Magmadar's fear in MC.

- FD when you see things are going apes#it and don't have to pay the repair bills at the end of the month

- Yeah aspects are good as you don't have to activate them over and over again, but this is quite comparable to Paladin auras

 

However...

To play hunter at it's maximum potential, you're far from "easymode".

 

What the common braindead huntard would do on it's common weekly MC raid would be autoshooting trash mobs and bosses, and wait to get some of phat lewt, and maybe shoot a tranq shot or two if needed.

 

The thing is, most of hunters don't even use pets in raids, as they would die out first few seconds of some boss fights.

This is incorrect!

If you spend your pet's skill points into resistance needed for raid (for example FR for MC) and get your hands on 5 pieces of T1 you can get quite nice FR on the pet (+FR aura if you're ally and ask to be in group with Paladin that has it on), and let your pet survive a lot longer.

You should CALL OUT pet on AoE abilities that bosses use: Geddon's AoE, Ony's tail sweep, Gehennas's rain of fire, etc.

 

Pets are way too underestimated, and some hunters fear to use them in raids as they can cause chaos by petpulling or not dismissing when taking shortcuts, but if played correctly, hunters have high skill ceiling as you have to play your hunter and your pet at same time.

Their damage is kinda bugged here on nostalrius (Lupos's shadow dmg isn't scripted correctly), and is lower as it should be.

And yes, wolf's furious howl was tested and if played correctly having pet up and dps-ing would result in bigger DPS output than just having it stand by you.

 

Another thing would be rotations, which can increase or decrease your DPS if not using correct rotation for your weapon as it varies on weapon's speed

(wouldn't go into details here as you can probably find the different types of hunter rotations somewhere on Nost's forums or elsewhere)

 

I personally didn't had any problems with ammo, but yeah, i know some people bought AV arrows as they were less efficient as thorium ones

 

Last but not least, the spots for raiding are totally different for every person, but since only like 2-4 hunters are needed for raid, I'd say it's harder to get spot than let's say healers, but easier than Rogue or Fury Warr, so it depends on guild's need and your personal dedication

 

 

So yeah... hunters are easy to play, but so can be healer if you're not downranking your spells = you're baddie, and is far from being easymode..

That kind of thinking gave hunters overall bad reputation and prejudices.

[фткyн 1469]

Hunters have hardest dps rotation in vanilla, shadow bolt spam a way easier.

[Undertanker 88]

Its hard to understand all of the ins/outs of a class you've never played and have zero experience with you know? I still like the appeal of a Lock I just have no experience to fall back on you know?

 

You will have plenty of time to learn your class while leveling and doing 5 mans and UBRS.   If you are slacking on something typically expected of a class, somebody will ask you to do that thing.   After a couple of raids, it will be second nature.

[Drain 19]

The thing with pets is that the DPS is so low it doesn't matter, and the fellow is just going to die every fight. Waste the food reviving it before every fight if you really want to... but don't act like it's making any kind of difference on the outcome. I often used my pet, but I did it just for laughs and for the added difficulty, because raiding as a Hunter was so effortless and almost boring. My first pick was Rogue, and MDPS has the most difficulty, but it was actually overplayed, where as Hunter, the easiest DPS class, had the lowest population. After failing to keep a slot as Rogue, I switched, and was quickly spoiled for it. Less work, no real competition on slots or tier sets. I could have went with either of the casters, because I had all of these at 60 already, but Hunter was the lowest played.

[houdre 0]

The thing with pets is that the DPS is so low it doesn't matter, and the fellow is just going to die every fight. Waste the food reviving it before every fight if you really want to... but don't act like it's making any kind of difference on the outcome. I often used my pet, but I did it just for laughs and for the added difficulty, because raiding as a Hunter was so effortless and almost boring. My first pick was Rogue, and MDPS has the most difficulty, but it was actually overplayed, where as Hunter, the easiest DPS class, had the lowest population. After failing to keep a slot as Rogue, I switched, and was quickly spoiled for it. Less work, no real competition on slots or tier sets. I could have went with either of the casters, because I had all of these at 60 already, but Hunter was the lowest played.

Sorry to break it to you, but you played it wrong than.

Your statemen on the pet having low DPS and dying EVERY fight is so wrong.. Half of MC bosses can be done with pets surviving whole fight, but you have to position and move your pet correctly.

It has ~65dps unbuffed and can reach around 100dps if fully buffed, which I wouldn't count as low dps, even if it survives only half of fights.

As you've said hunter is for you the easiest class as you haven't used pet and just used rotation (and by any chance that rotation was wrong also), so that was in the end just afk-autoshoting and aim/multi every 10s or so.

Don't really see why the diffuculty would be the highest on meelee dps, besides the positioning?

Dunno why it was underplayed though, we almost always had too many or right enough in our raids..

[Undertanker 88]

Yeah, that's what sucks for hunters.. no matter how much effort you put into it, you still won't be top dps unless other dps are slacking :S

That's probably why people just stop trying as they can't top the dps meters

 

Should be competing against members of your same class.   Also they can dish early burst damage on aggro sensitive fights and FD BEFORE!!!!!! they pull threat. /pray that the 17% resist doesn't get them.

[фткyн 1469]

^ true, and as hunt you can't top dps metres vs good melee, bcz gear updates too weak, no big deal pre raid vs t2, only ranged wep

[houdre 0]

Yeah, that's what sucks for hunters.. no matter how much effort you put into it, you still won't be top dps unless other dps are slacking :S

That's probably why people just stop trying as they can't top the dps meters

[meddlingmage 3]

You will have plenty of time to learn your class while leveling and doing 5 mans and UBRS.   If you are slacking on something typically expected of a class, somebody will ask you to do that thing.   After a couple of raids, it will be second nature.

I completely agree with you, of course the more I learn it the more I'll understand it. What I'm saying is, I don't want to spend countless hours having fun and blowing ish up while going from 1-60, only to be greeted at level 60 with "hey whatever you did leveling, the exact opposite is expected of you here" if that makes sense.