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Raziya

Hunter Macros & Tips [Redux]

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Hey guys, I just did the Maraudon bosses nude :D

I plan on doing a Mara Redux tutorial to address the changes made to Princess, and also to show Landslide, but I figured I would mention it here that I did it without any clothes since folks have been like "but Raziya, you need gear for those bosses!" Just weapons - Warblade of the Hakkari with +15 agil, Fang of the Faceless with +15 agil, and Ashjre'thul with +7 damage. I'm 7/31/13 atm, IAOTH and IRP. Impetus has no +armor from training and, as I just mentioned, there are no BM talents that boost his armor.

So it's not so bad! With full clothes, a more tough pet, better pet spec, or better spec of my own, it's much much easier. I replaced Damascus with Impetus because I no longer need Damascus' incredibly tough armor; it's pretty much overcompensation with my gear, but seeing as I can do it without gear despite the pet's weakness, I think that makes it rather clear the farm isn't as difficult as it might seem.

While I didn't fraps it since I was in the middle of something else, I did take a couple of screenies. :p
http://i.imgur.com/H51oXFC.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/vg6xIMx.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/c0dS18l.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/DHJohLr.jpg

I one-shot tinker and princess, they weren't so difficult, although Princess did require some careful maneuvering. Her boulders hit like 500 on an unarmored target and mend mana was pretty scarce, so I'd have to put some distance between us rather often to feign / drink or bandage or mend. Very tedious, but certainly possible. Rotgrip was pretty interesting, though - he took... I think four attempts? Maybe five. First time I got him to 20%, nothing special happened, just forgot to pop burst. Second time I screwed up the initial pull and threat, but nothing else happened. Third and fourth times had evade bugs due to new position, if the last try wasn't the fourth...

I thought I got another screenie of Rotgrip's corpse, but I guess not. Sorry! I did get one at 1%, though it's not substantial proof given that he can bite and instantly heal like 5%... but, then again, a hunter can always feign death mid-fight and swap out sets, so there's no proving it without a vid, is there? Guess you'll just have to take my word for it :p

Anyway, the last try I'm gonna talk about at length, 'cause it was pretty fun and I think it might help folks who haven't progressed their gear very much to cope with Rotgrip. I don't remember with absolute precision, so maybe it was Mend spam first, maybe it was Rapid Fire first, I don't know, but you'll get the gist of how it went.

I jumped down the waterfall after Princess and left an immo trap at the bottom of the pool, then positioned Impetus right behind it. When Rotgrip was in sight, I put up Hawk, checked TSA duration, dropped a Hunter's Mark on Rotgrip, and then used Outfitter to swap out all my gear except weapons.

I kept my gear on for prep because my mana pool was higher, so I could set up for the fight and then remove it all. My max mana pool would go down, but being nude, my mana pool was effectively maxed out when the maximum was lowered.

To initiate, I sent Impetus at Rotgrip. When his Growl went off, I made him retreat a little bit, then sent him back for another Growl. I did this one more time before Rotgrip was at the Immolation Trap so he'd have plenty of aggro to start. I made sure to hit Rotgrip a little along the way, myself, and proceeded with Auto Shots and rank 1 Multi-Shots.

I popped Rapid Fire about halfway through, if I remember correctly. I also used some Aimed Shots. Unfortunately, at some point through Rapid Fire, I accidentally pulled aggro and re-actively feigned Rotgrip off. This is unfortunate because once Rapid Fire was over, I couldn't, uhh... you know what, I think it was mend spam first. Then I popped Rapid Fire to deal as much damage as I possibly could with the little boost I had given Impetus. I remember being too OOM to Distracting Shot... oh, I think that's why I couldn't get aggro. Not that I had feigned the aggro off, I just hadn't garnered enough threat, and was too OOM to force it over. I think pulling aggro during Rapid Fire was during another attempt.

Anyway, at 20%, Impetus was almost within one-shot range of Rotgrip, so I toggled off Growl and Lightning Breath and sent him at a hydra far away. With Dive, he easily out-swam Rotgrip and I made him stay before the hydra was pulled. Rotgrip eventually caught up, killed him, and started coming back to me, but he was at 10%. I popped Deterrence and Aspect of the Monkey, but I was completely OOM, as you can see in the screenshot, so I spammed melee. I think I got one or two Mongoose Bites off from natural mana regeneration... and I had to pop a Sapper Charge off to deal enough damage to kill him.

Deterrence not only saved me from the 800~ damage his burst attack does to an unarmed target, but it also prevented him from landing that strike and healing 5% of his HP. So, pretty intense fight. Definitely would recommend an armored pet, but you don't really need equipment for it as long as you can keep your pet alive. Pull aggro once to let the bleeds fall off if you must, but other than that it's as it is in the original Maraudon tutorial - light DPS first, burst at end, mend casually.

I don't normally just ramble here on my own without someone asking me a question first, so I do hope the above is interesting. :) If you have any questions about the other bosses or whatever before I do Mara Redux, just ask 'em here!

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Naked Mara? Ill have to give it a watch!

I found a working mouseover macro, try this- it prioritizes casting on your mouseover if attackable, and if you dont have one it till attack your target

 

/cast concussive shot
/run c=CastSpellByName s="Concussive Shot" if UnitExists("mouseover") then TargetUnit("mouseover") c(s) TargetLastTarget() else c(s) end

 

 

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5 hours ago, dogg said:

Naked Mara? Ill have to give it a watch!

I found a working mouseover macro, try this- it prioritizes casting on your mouseover if attackable, and if you dont have one it till attack your target

 

/cast concussive shot
/run c=CastSpellByName s="Concussive Shot" if UnitExists("mouseover") then TargetUnit("mouseover") c(s) TargetLastTarget() else c(s) end

Sadly, I didn't get a recording :s I was busy doing other things at the time I was navigating between the bosses, so I didn't bother to set fraps up. But, I told the story as it happened :p Or at least how I remembered it happened.

Oh my gosh, finally! You know, I've been looking for that macro, I knew it existed but I never managed to find it again. Thank you so much for posting it here!! I'm sure it'll come in great handy for everyone. :D

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Quote

/script if not buffed("Aspect of the Hawk") then cast("Aspect of the Hawk") end

Quote

/script if not buffed("Aspect of the Monkey") then cast("Aspect of the Monkey") end

Found these useful for people such as myself, who are a bit into spamming abilities. These will not cancel the existing aspect if spammed.

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24 minutes ago, Morriv said:

Found these useful for people such as myself, who are a bit into spamming abilities. These will not cancel the existing aspect if spammed.

I believe those only work with SuperMacro.

There should be a Deterrence macro in the OP containing a default-compatible Monkey spammable macro.

Still, thank you!

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18 minutes ago, Raziya said:

I believe those only work with SuperMacro.

There should be a Deterrence macro in the OP containing a default-compatible Monkey spammable macro.

Still, thank you!

Ah, yes, they do require supermacro. Forgot to mention that, thanks. Well, maybe someone will find these shorter ones useful.

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 uhhh this guy solos it at 54 using either a bloodseeker or carapace spine which does much less dmg than smiting..so thats not really a feat of soloing princess naked ;)

its probably possible to solo even at lvl 45 but the problem is getting there

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Hey man thanks for the guide and the macros!

 

I'd like to hear your ideas on this:

I finally started raiding classic recently on Elysium, took a while ...

In molten core my cat keeps on dying on trash but also on bosses, what do you think is the best way to avoid this or at least reduce the hassle a little ?

I thought about training fire resistance on my cat just for MC, or try to work with the wind serpents lightning breath, do you have any suggestions ?


Cheers

 

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17 hours ago, Supremepleb said:

Hey man thanks for the guide and the macros!

 

I'd like to hear your ideas on this:

I finally started raiding classic recently on Elysium, took a while ...

In molten core my cat keeps on dying on trash but also on bosses, what do you think is the best way to avoid this or at least reduce the hassle a little ?

I thought about training fire resistance on my cat just for MC, or try to work with the wind serpents lightning breath, do you have any suggestions ?


Cheers

Hey there, fam ^^ You're very welcome! It's my pleasure.

Let's see... on Elysium, Lupos should be absolute BiS at the moment, so if you get the chance, try to get him! He's hard to find but oh-so worth it. At least, worth it until he gets nerfed into a normal wolf at some point shortly before AQ... and I wouldn't recommend a Wind Serpent until Zul'Gurub comes out, since they'll only have rank 5 Lightning Breath until then. Once ZG is out, you can tame a Son for rank 6.

But, pardon me, I digress. Cats are the least responsive of the popular trio of raiding pets on account of their hard focus dumps. Whereas a wolf has no focus dumps and will Dash as long as it's not on GCD, and whereas a Wind Serpent is a toss-up with Lightning Breath having no cooldown, but costing 50 focus (so it may or may not have enough for dive), Cats will spam Claw and Bite all the time. The best advice I could give for keeping your cat alive in a raiding environment is to give it a ton of stamina and resistance suitable for the raid you'll be doing. The stamina is good for soaking up more damage in general and the resistance will act like armor against raid mechanics, occasionally reducing the amount of fire damage your cat takes. It's not as reliable as armor, but it's something. Armor, on the other hand, is totally useless in a raiding environment on a pet, so don't give your pet any at all if you want to make the most of your points.

Be proactive about controlling your cat. Since it will likely fail to use Dash on the way out, pull it back a little earlier than you would other beasts, before that deadly mechanic goes out! If you leave it at your side for a few after it's been injured, a healer should toss a little something its way, or if you get the opportunity, Mend Pet, yourself.

Oh, and keeping a pet alive will take practice! Bring it to each boss thinking, "Okay, how do I approach this?" And be ready to use some pet control macros. You'll get used to the added mechanics of pet control versus Molten Core eventually!

Some boss advice:

Spoiler

Lucifron is nasty on pets and unless you kill that boss super quickly, your pet is very likely to die, so just have it do as much damage as possible before it does, or keep it far away from the boss if you want to save its buffs.

For Magmadar, just rotate around him and use Follow and Attack commands to reposition your pet where there isn't fire in the melee, for instance.

Gehennas and Garr are easy, for Gehennas you keep it out of Rain of Fire (which may involve you, yourself, repositioning so your cat follows in the right direction), for Garr you just pull your pet back whenever one of the little adds is about to die and then just send him in forever on Garr... you should get the hang of this one pretty quick. Just make sure you account for your pet's slower speed if it's within range of Garr's AoE slow pulse. You will need to pull it away sooner so it can survive to fight the next one.

Geddon can be a little tricky, I see a lot of guilds have pets stack up on one spot and they ALL die by the end of it, and that's quite frankly wasteful. Set a stay position for your cat that's at its own bomb spot, preferably at a location where it won't run through the raid, and use the retreat macro in the pet tutorial (section 3.2.2) to make it dash out if needed. Geddon will do a massive fire AoE, so be ready to send your pet out before that happens. Your pet can also get the bomb on Geddon, so make sure you're ready to run it out if it does get Living Bomb on it.

Shazzrah is that kind of boss you'd probably need to keep your pet out for. If your guild has great DPS, and perhaps if your pet has some Arcane resistance, it could last long enough to see the end of the fight, or near the end of the fight. If not, know that if you send it in or keep it at your side, Shazzrah will eventually kill it. If you'd prefer not to lose your pet, keep it far away on stay! If it doesn't have any special buffs, consider it expendable.

The Sulfuron Harbinger will occasionally stun targets in melee range and deal a little damage, but he shouldn't give you much trouble. Go to town on him.

Golemagg will place a stacking debuff on melee DPS that stay in, and he'll enrage at some point, probably killing your pet if it hasn't died already. This point is at 10%. My recommendation for using any pet on him is to request a mage give your pet Dampen Magic; it should last a LOT longer. If you want to keep it alive, pull it out before 10%, and if necessary, before the stacks get too high.

Majordomo Executus and his Flamewaker Elites all do an AoE fire attack. Keep your pet out of melee against these unless you want it to die. The Flamewaker Healers, on the other hand, are fair game. A popular strategy for Majordomo is to kill two Elites, bring the other two low, then kill two healers before finishing the last elites off, followed of course by the last two healers. This ensures only two healers will become enraged and polymorph-immune, making the fight easier. Whatever opportunity you get to send your pet in at isolated elites or healers, take it! Just remember to watch its health when it engages elites, even isolated ones.

The biggest threat Ragnaros will pose to your pet is when he splashes lava around. He does this fairly often, actually. Use the retreat macro to send your pet back to the melee spot before every knockback so he doesn't stay in melee and get one-shot while there's no tank on Ragnaros. Other than that, just mend him if you can or if you care after your pet's been splashed with lava often enough, and remember to reposition him before Ragnaros re-emerges if you get Sons. Oh, yes, and Sons of Flame shouldn't be a threat to your pet so long as they're tanked. They will eat your mana though.

And trash details:

Spoiler

Molten Giants and Molten Destroyers deal damage to nearby melee targets. Destroyers are significantly more dangerous. If you send your pet in on these, make sure he's close to only ONE of the giants at a time, and be ready to pull him out if things look hairy. I've never asked a mage to drop Dampen Magic on my pet for these, but I suppose it might help. Their stomp is more bursty, so hypothetically it would have lesser benefit.

Firelords pose no threat to your pet. They summon spawns and silence people and hit the tank, and that's about it. Have fun with them, but remember to kill the spawns... and don't send your pet at a spawn before a tank can get on it, of course. You may as well leave it on the Firelord, actually.

Annihilators are annoying. They drop aggro constantly and, well, I've never seen one kill my pet, but I imagine it could happen. Kill 'em quick and move on.

Surgers will charge people, dealing some damage to everyone at the impact location, including you or your pet. Obviously, stacking up on surgers will remedy that, and I presume that's already what you're doing, so. Just try to keep your pet away from its charge destination and it won't take needless damage.

Keep your pet out on Flame Imps unless it can breathe lightning or there's only one loose in the raid or something. That is all.

The Core Hound packs before Magmadar should pose no threat as long as your tanks have aggro. Moving on.

Full-grown Core Hounds may have various effects to mess with players, but the only problem your pet may have is suffering the brunt of its flame breath. If your pet is in front of a Core Hound for some reason, make sure you're to either of its sides or its back, use the follow command, and then use the attack command. This will quickly take your pet out of danger.

Firewalkers cast Fire Blossom, which can pretty much one-shot people or pets. They also reduce raiders' fire resistance. They should always be the first priority in whatever group they're pulled with.

Flameguards are not as dangerous, but they have a cone attack which could harm your pet. Try to keep your pet behind these.

The Lava Reavers occasionally found in late-instance packs can cleave. I've never noticed a problem with them, but if your pet's taking heavy damage there, keep him on the Reaver's tail or pull him out of there.

Lava Elementals can stun the entire raid and deal damage over time. It's more damage than it might seem. Keep your pet behind these... and try to stay on their backs, yourself.

That should be all the bosses and trash. Hopefully that helps. Good luck on your next raid!! If you need anything else, just let me know ^^

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Thank you very much!

I guess ill train fire resistance on my cat and see how that works,  while trying to get Lupos which really is a pain in the ass  ^^

 

Thank you again !

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2 hours ago, Supremepleb said:

Thank you very much!

I guess ill train fire resistance on my cat and see how that works,  while trying to get Lupos which really is a pain in the ass  ^^

Thank you again !

Good luck :p With pet survivability and Lupos.

The pet control is really what makes the difference; I can't really emphasize that enough. It takes a little getting used to, keeping an eye on your pet while you do your normal damage dealing, but like I said, practice makes perfect!

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Yop

to pvp spine xbow is better than bloodseeker one cause of stamina and higher potential dmg right? 

And why to pve bloodseeker is better than spine xbow? Str is just for melee att mb u can explain it to me (a better constant dps?)

I watch the pvp build u suggest in 0/21/30, why improuv clever trap in pvp, i mean freeze trap will be 12sec for first time after all. That s ensure the 12sec? To me clever trap is for pve but trap mastery is good to pvp

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3 hours ago, Manara said:

Yop

to pvp spine xbow is better than bloodseeker one cause of stamina and higher potential dmg right? 

And why to pve bloodseeker is better than spine xbow? Str is just for melee att mb u can explain it to me (a better constant dps?)

Hi ^^

http://db.vanillagaming.org/?item=18738
http://db.vanillagaming.org/?item=19107

Here are CPCB and BS respectively.

CPCB has a damage range of 82-124, a speed of 3.3, and a DPS of 31.2, according to VDB.
BS has a damage range of 85-128, a speed of 3.3, and a DPS of 32.3, according to VDB.

While BS has strength, it also has more agility than CPCB and a slightly better damage range. The damage range is what boosts the damage of your Multi-Shot and Aimed Shot, and this in addition to the extra agility makes BS better for PvE. Strength also boosts melee damage, so if you're a PvPer, I don't think it's quite as useful as stamina, not by a longshot, but it is still a stat you may use from time to time and it isn't unreasonable to take, provided you're not sacrificing more important stats like agility or stamina.

Stamina is a favored stat for PvP, but I personally prefer a more glass cannon sort of playstyle. I stack as much agility as possible and if I get stamina, that's fine, but if not, it's no concern. More agility is more firepower, so more agility is what I go for. That said, CPCB is a perfectly viable alternative to BS, but if you play with allies, stealthily, or in ways that help you avoid direct confrontations most of the time, stamina isn't that big a deal. I'll go over my own favorite PvP spec to show you what I mean, in just a sec! And I'll also explain why the logic favoring BS over CPCB can be applied to a talent like Survivalist, while I'm at it.

3 hours ago, Manara said:

I watch the pvp build u suggest in 0/21/30, why improuv clever trap in pvp, i mean freeze trap will be 12sec for first time after all. That s ensure the 12sec? To me clever trap is for pve but trap mastery is good to pvp

Good question. Freezing Trap tends to break early all the time in PvP, but that's not the reason to get Clever Traps! Clever Traps increases the duration of your Frost Trap by 9 seconds, allowing you to zone for your team for that much longer, which is super helpful for all-out fights like the initial both-team zerg to BS in AB, or covering choke points like mid exit in WSG. It also boosts the damage of your Immolation Trap, which is awesomely helpful in a 1v1 against a very persistent and heavily armored melee DPS. In fact, I was duoing some BGs the other day with this thing:

http://db.vanillagaming.org/?item=19950

And the fun thing about it is, it boosts the damage of our Arcane Shot, Serpent Sting, Immolation Trap, and Explosive Trap... but none of our skills count as spells. So we get the full benefit for the whole duration! I was doing the normal auto / aimed / multi w/ ambushing people sort of strategy most of the time, but every two minutes I'd pop this thing off and flop a melee with the hard DoTs and max-rank Arcane Shot. Full SP out of the blue. It usually worked out; without the ZHC, those abilities are more supplementary, a little too slow and probably won't out-DPS a warrior sticking to you like glue, but with it, they almost always flop before you do. Fun!

Pardon me, I digress. The point was, clever traps is still useful even if Freezing Trap remains unreliable, and I like the talent.

3 hours ago, Manara said:

0/21/30

i will go like that to pvp

http://db.vanillagaming.org/?talent#cZtVohtZ0Ebmkhux

Tons of text:

Spoiler

That's a fine spec indeed, but a couple of things puzzle me. You're not gonna get both Slaying talents? I dunno if I mentioned in the guide, but Monster Slaying will work against feral druids and ghost wolf shamans. The reason I don't like Deflection for PvP is because melee DPS are probably not going to be on you for long, if at all, and the slaying talents will go to better use as you burst down clothies or something. If a melee IS on you, I'd say there are better talents than Deflection for dealing with them.

You know already that Survivalist isn't really my thing since I like to stay away from combat and snipe people, from Shadowmeld and/or by surprise if possible, but it's indubitably an excellent choice for PvP. The benefit it gives scales very well.

I'll go into my own choices and explain in detail why I prefer the options I list. There are two Surv-centric PvP specs I really like, and while they may seem barely different at all, they're really quite different in application! Here they are:

Scatter / IWC: http://db.vanillagaming.org/?talent#cZxVkhtZI0ibRhux
WS / Entrap: http://db.vanillagaming.org/?talent#cZxVkhxZIVbbRhut

I'll go over the talents common to each spec first, then go over how the six different points change the style of gameplay so much. The talent choices may be obvious in some cases and I shouldn't need to explain, but I like to be a captain obvious anyway for the sake of being thorough and complete.

Marksman
5/5 Improved Concussive Shot
- Three second stun? Cool. Random and each attempt is on a 12 second cooldown, but when it happens, it's nice. If you're leveling up with this, that three-second stun at the low levels is practically a death sentence.
5/5 Lethal Shots - More critical strike chance on ranged attacks. Awesome for a burst-focused class like hunters.
1/1 Aimed Shot - Obviously this is for taking a nice, big 3k crit crap over clothies.
1/5 Improved Arcane Shot - The other filler talents are Efficiency and Improved Hunter's Mark. I typically don't have any issues with mana and Improved Hunter's Mark is pointless for me 'cause I hardly use Hunter's Mark. I prefer to attack before they have any idea I'm looking at them :D So I don't drop that big red mark on their heads. Hunter's Mark can also be dispelled, and it doesn't make THAT much of a difference in PvP anyway. Why favor Improved Arcane Shot then? I like to get back to my Aimed Shot as soon as possible, and I use rank 1 Arcane Shot all the time for tagging people off flags if I get there just in time, poking someone before they can mount up, preventing a person from drinking, other stuff like that. I just like it! Efficiency is the one I would recommend if you don't like Arcane Shot at all, though.
3/3 Hawk Eye - More range, more potential for sniping. And you can Scatter Shot / Wyvern Sting from further away too!
5/5 Mortal Shots - 30% more critical strike damage. This is awesome for a burst-focused class like hunters, and it perfectly complements Lethal Shots and Killer Instinct.

Survival
3/3 Monster Slaying - For feral druids and ghost wolf shamans. Druid flag carriers are annoying as hell.
3/3 Humanoid Slaying - For everyone else. Since it boosts all damage AND critical strike damage, it works really nicely with Lethal Shots and Killer Instinct.
2/2 Savage Strikes - Awesome deterrent for anyone who tries to get in close. With a nice 2h, your Raptor / Mongoose could do 50% of a clothie's HP instantly. I once one-shot a mage with a Raptor / Mongoose crit and the weapon I had had a proc on it, and the proc's direct damage crit as well. Was a hilarious probably-one-time thing. Why did I have a Mongoose proc on a mage, you ask? I don't know. I just did. True story!
2/2 Clever Traps - Already explained. Better immolation trap for bothering warriors, better frost trap for zoning. I have another story about Clever Traps working out... I was back on Kronos, right? And I was out in Searing Gorge helping my lowbie dr00d friend with a quest, and I was waiting on my jumpers to get off their initial CD so I could try and res him. 60 orc fury warrior comes outta nowhere and tries to kill me, I was... I think level 55 at the time, and I happened to have a pre-emptive Freezing Trap laid down, so I trapped him in that. Can't be too careful in contested zones, especially with a friend down. Got myself back to full, dropped an Immolation Trap in front of me, and got an Aimed Auto Multi Auto combo off on him, and a Serpent Sting, before he managed to catch up to me again. Popped Deterrence (despite Overpower, it still helps against warriors), took out the Ravager, got some Bladestorms and Raptor Strikes off, and GG. Barely survived! Sadly, you can't auto attack, Raptor Strike, or do any of the other cool stuff you can do with a Ravager on Kronos here on Elysium, but you get the idea. It was mostly melee and DoT damage that killed the guy; it all adds up. And it must be emphasized that the fact that Serpent Sting or Immolation Trap deal magic damage, instead of physical damage, means you'll have more of a chance against armored targets!
1/1 Deterrence - The amazing life-saver when you're in a really bad spot. I know you already have it in your spec, so obviously you know how good it is, but you can see another great example of Deterrence working out when I manage to dodge a rogue's Kidney Shot in my Alterac Valley update vid. It was after defense at IWB. Very good talent :D
2/2 Trap Mastery - Lower chance for enemies to resist your traps. Good on its own, but even better with Clever Traps.
3/3 Surefooted - While the main appeal of this talent is the ability to resist movement impairing effects more often, the 3% hit could get you to the 5% cap for PvP more easily. If you want to wear gear with more agility, but lack the hit cap, that little extra bit is nice to have.
3/3 Killer Instinct - More crit chance on ALL attacks. Since you already have Savage Strikes for melee, that's not that big a deal, but the fact that it also boosts your ranged crit chance really helps out your burst.
1/1 Counterattack - Nice if it procs on its own, practically guaranteed when you pop Deterrence. Can't rely on it on its own, but it'll further boost your defenses during Deterrence if you can root the target hamming on you ASAP. No longer a chance to dodge or parry them, but no incoming potential damage at all!
5/5 Lightning Reflexes - This talent becomes viable for PvE past 480 agility unbuffed, if I remember correctly. It's fine for PvP at any point because it doesn't have to compete with Trueshot Aura being given to four melee DPS. This talent is especially cool with higher gear levels, and obviously it boosts your crit chance AND your attack power, since agility. It's also extra fun when you have Spirit of Zandalar or Blessing of Kings.

Those are the points common to either spec, and my own mindset while choosing them, but then there's the choice between Scatter and IWC, or WS and Entrap. Before I describe them specifically, I should go over the Survival filler points.

You have three options for filler points in Survival by the second tier if you take both Slaying talents and Savage Strikes. They are Deflection, Entrapment, and Improved Wing Clip.

Deflection is a talent I prefer for PvE. I do the pulling in all my guild's raids, and sometimes that involves tanking an Ancient Core Hound in Molten Core until a tank can drop by and pick it up, sometimes it means I need to hold onto a Death Talon Hatcher in Blackwing Lair for one, or even two auto attacks under bad circumstances before I get some support... in Ahn'qiraj, I've tanked Giant Claw Tentacles on C'thun for quite a few auto attacks if tanks are across the room, so they don't despawn and just go back to full HP. I also need to cover any DPS who might be randomly summoned onto Anubisath Defenders, block an attack from a Qiraji Lasher on the packs before Huhu if one catches up to me somehow, and if one of those blue bugs starts going off on a healer in the gauntlet before Fankriss, their auto attack will likely kill me or get pretty damn close to killing me if I distract it to save a healer. In the cases I need to tag Firemaw from far away from the raid in Blackwing Lair, pull one of the Bug Trio bosses over to the spots they'll be tanked at, or other stuff like that, Deflection remains helpful. Deterrence is obviously the MAJOR factor in keeping me alive under those circumstances, but Deflection is worth it and even preferred over IWC or Entrap in PvE, especially considering how often I find myself on the head of some hard-hitting elite.

Scatter / IWC
Improved Wing Clip is something most, if not all raid mobs are immune to, first of all. For PvP, it remains incredibly useful. The obvious use may be getting a melee off of you with an IWC proc, but due to its application, it's functionally MUCH different from Counterattack. You don't need to parry anything for it to work, you can just spam Wing Clip, so you can root a healer or caster, stunt a powershifting druid's movement even more while your friends kill it, and you have greater defense against melee while your Deterrence is down. You can Wing Clip a rogue, step back and probably have time to pop off an Auto Multi Auto on them before they're free, should the root proc. It also helps if your Scatter Shot is down, like... one of the mistakes mages usually do in PvP is blink in close while your Scatter's up. Good mages, or players for that matter, will wait for enemy cooldowns before they capitalize on the advantage, but mages are like, "Meh, if I can go in and frost nova, he's doomed." I was in... I think it was AV, one time, and at midfield I'd just finished mopping up a shaman (I think it was a shaman) when a mage blinked right in at me. Scatter was down, so I couldn't punish his aggressive blink, but I got an Improved Wing Clip proc on him and danced right on out of Frost Nova range just before he popped it off. Was a fun little exchange.

Given that Improved Wing Clip greatly benefits your ability to 1v1, it makes a great supplement to Scatter Shot, which is an awesome setup shot and gives you great versatility in engagements, where you can interrupt a caster's spell, trap someone more easily, peel for an ally, defend yourself from encroaching aggressors, and more. Therefore, the first spec I linked with Scatter and IWC is more of a contender specialization. You can go and get into scraps liberally and have the tools to survive. You can defend yourself effectively.

WS / Entrap
The other specialization with WS / Entrap is quite different because you lack said tools. While the first spec may allow you to, y'know, take the front line and eat some damage and escape really easily, this one's more a back-line specialization. Very much support-oriented.

Entrapment, if used in PvE, can be really dangerous, rather than simply useless. Say you drop a Frost Trap on Fankriss and your tank needs to move around a bunch to reposition for blocks and gather up all the small bugs. He's gonna be out of range of quite a few of 'em, right? If your Frost Trap procs Entrapment on a few bugs, they're gonna smack healers, not only potentially killing them, but maybe even interrupting their casts enough to put the main tanks at perilously low HP, since rooted monsters will smack whatever's nearby instead of waiting to be free and run after the highest on threat. Same deal with the Infernals on Nefarian, they could get rooted around healers and spam stun them, and that's just asking for trouble. In PvP, however, Entrapment makes an already powerful zoning ability - Frost Trap - into an absolutely overpowered cockblock for the enemy team. The root spam while standing in a Frost Trap will ensure your opponents don't have a chance to make it through, and it can be a lot of fun in a team fight where your healz can just step away from melee that keep getting rooted over and over and over again. It's not as reliable as IWC for 1v1s or other small scale fights, especially fights that move around a lot, but you'll be amazing support for your team as you restrict enemy movement in specific locations in the battleground.

I'm a night elf, so I have even more opportunities to use Wyvern Sting, but even if you don't have stealth, it remains useful. Unlike Scatter Shot, Wyvern Sting cannot be used in combat (unless you blow Feign Death), it has a 2-minute cooldown, and with Hawk Eye it has a 41 yard range. It puts an enemy target to sleep for 12 seconds, and then deals some damage to them once the sleep is broken.

This is like the ultimate screw-you ability to stragglers and healers. Unless that resto druid at Lumber Mill has a friend who can dispel poisons, or has Abolish Poison up pre-emptively, or something, your Wyvern Sting will prevent them from saving the other guy guarding LM with them. It's especially useful if you're with friends, since they can get a head-start on whatever's not asleep and help you kill it faster, before the asleep target wakes up. You can use it in Warsong Gulch during the initial fight at mid to instantly take the priest behind all their DPS out of the fight while all your buddies wreck their damage dealers. If you see their flag carrier, you can ride right up and sleep 'em from nice and far away. Wyvern Sting someone before the zerg to the enemy base, and that's an instant death sentence since while they're trying to catch up, they'll be all alone with archer fire and elites on the road focused on them. It's like a Freezing Trap from 41 yards away, and you can even CC TWO targets with it and Freezing Trap. For example, I was guarding Gold Mine solo one time and I left my cat unstealthed in one bush while I was shadowmelded in another. Some scrub rogue took the bait and ate the freezing trap I left in the bush, but before I could go over and one-shot him, some warrior showed up. I was out of combat just as he dismounted to charge, so he got a Wyvern Sting, the rogue went down easily, and then I was able to take care of the warrior easy peasy.

If you want to see Wyvern Sting in action, and get a feel for the amount of damage you could possibly get out in 12 seconds, I demonstrate it in The Hunter's Toolkit (section 3.2.2 in the OP) at 25:30 (linked also in the description). It's demonstrated on Kronos and I have pretty crappy gear on that server (less than pre-raid BiS) and I manage to nearly kill a mob with 5.3k HP before the asleep target wakes up. I then kill the formerly asleep target just after the trapped target is broken free. The trap / sleep timing will naturally be different in PvP, but from the demonstration you can see how much of a difference two CC targets could make, or at least how much of a difference twelve seconds or so could make!

...And, of course, in the cases you're not juking someone with Shadowmeld tricks, simply dropping a Freezing Trap at your feet before popping off a Wyvern Sting will ensure you have both available. Then you just need to lead one target into the trap :) Anyway, to summarize, this second spec is something best played with friends, behind allies, or with care. You have the ability to really screw up enemy players with creative use of Wyvern Sting and nice use of Entrapment, but you yourself lack much defense. Support-centric spec.

Both specializations have great burst potential, so whether you scatter > trapped a priest to charge up that Aimed Shot, or you're comboing a vulnerable sleeping or entrapped target, you're gonna hit hard either way.

Why not use Entrapment with Scatter Shot, or Improved Wing Clip with Wyvern Sting? No reason. The above lists my own preferences, and I prefer not to mix 'em because if I have Wyvern Sting, I try to play support, and Entrapment is the better support talent. If I have Scatter Shot, I'm more aggressive, so Improved Wing Clip does wonders for survivability in that case. Survivalist may help if you're taking damage, but I try to CC people (and not get CC'd, myself) so I don't take much damage at all, or simply outrange people. The points in IWC will prevent a melee DPS from hitting you entirely for some time, rather than Survivalist giving you more potential to soak damage. It could prevent a mage from deadzoning you, allowing you to turn the tables on him. Different sort of playstyle, same potential for survivability. You get the idea.

I apologize for going on so long, but I hope my explanation has helped you consider the application of your PvP talents more thoroughly, and I hope I've expressed my own reasons for enjoying the listed talents adequately. Please do hit me up if you need anything else. :)

Edit: P.S. - To anyone else looking for updates, I know I haven't posted a new video in, like, months. Really sorry about that, been busy as hell. I've been raid logging too, so I dunno how I'm gonna keep up with everything and still manage to prep enough consumes for Naxx since I've been lazy about playing the AH... but I'm trying, alright? ^^ When I get the next thing done, I'll be sure to let y'all know. And hey, you can always ask in this thread if you want to know something specific! I may not be able to edit videos at the moment but I can still give a lengthy response in text form. Thanks for understanding!! :D

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I checked and compare thoses xbow and i was pretty sure that spine xbow had higher dmg... (In elysium) now i can have both i will check it Again with the both in my inventory( mb bloodseeker is up for next patches)

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3 hours ago, Manara said:

I checked and compare thoses xbow and i was pretty sure that spine xbow had higher dmg... (In elysium) now i can have both i will check it Again with the both in my inventory( mb bloodseeker is up for next patches)

I dunno how it will turn out on Elysium, but on Anathema or Nost 1.0, I've only ever seen the stats listed on VDB for the CPCB and Bloodseeker. So, what information I provided is all I've ever known.

If you find some significant different, you can always link a screenie here or something if you're still not sure which is preferable. :)

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why doesnt this work for me?

 

/script CastSpellByName(“Hunter’s Mark”);PetAttack();CastSpellByName(“Auto Shot”);

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2 hours ago, task73 said:

why doesnt this work for me?

/script CastSpellByName(“Hunter’s Mark”);PetAttack();CastSpellByName(“Auto Shot”);

Hi!

It seems the problem you're running into is that the Hunter's Mark cast overwrites your Auto Shot. I REALLY wouldn't recommend using a lazy macro for all three of these functions unless you're, like, on the PvE server and leveling up purely by AFK auto-shooting. You won't improve your skills with a macro like this!

Nevertheless, if you want it fixed, try this instead. I tested this in-game just now on Anathema and it works for me.

First, get this addon: https://github.com/shirsig/notoggle

This will enable you to use the simple "/cast Auto Shot" command instead of the no-repeat script typically used.

The fixed macro can then be used. Here:

Quote

/run local i,x=1,0 while UnitBuff("target",i) do if UnitBuff("target",i)=="Interface\\Icons\\Ability_Hunter_SniperShot" then x=1 end i=i+1 end if x==0 then CastSpellByName("Hunter's Mark") else end
/script PetAttack(target)
/cast Auto Shot

The first line will apply Hunter's Mark if it's not up already. The second line will send the pet to attack, and the third will cast Auto Shot. It will not toggle Auto Shot off if spammed, provided you have that addon. Once you have the macro done up, simply hit it twice and it'll perform all its functions. If you do not have a target, hit the macro three times while first facing the target you intend to strike.

Like I said, this is a lazy macro. Suitable for AFK farming, but not if you want to learn something while you level up. I'd recommend instead microing your pet's attacks on their own, applying and refreshing Hunter's Mark on specific targets as needed, and using Auto Shot on its own key. Should you go into raids with a macro like this, you'll drastically reduce your efficiency, and in PvP, the GCD Hunter's Mark triggers each time it's applied could get you killed. Practice makes perfect, and there's no better time to start practicing than early on!

Hope that helps. Good luck.

Edit: Hmph, it seems it still spams Hunter's Mark, but at least my Auto Shot is going off now... apologies, but I can't take more than a cursory glance at the script right now. It should work perfectly fine if you spam it two or three times for each target, but don't keep spamming it. Perhaps someone else can fix it up better so it works as intended. I hope it helps anyway; good luck!

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9 hours ago, Roxanne Flowers said:

A macro too lazy for the proverbial Lazy Hunter?

There's got to be a heresy in here somewhere ... why can't I find it?

Hey, I'm not lazy! I just raid-log, slack on consumables and world buffs, and don't use any of the tools I developed for more efficient hunter gameplay.

kappa

...On a related note, I'm working on an AQ40 tutorial for my guild at the moment. I have a few unlisted tutorials just meant for specific people or groups, and this one is meant to help out some new recruits with figuring stuff out sooner. Not that it's getting done any faster than the next dungeon video or tutorial though... urgh. I wish it were all freakin' done already... I'd also like to get the Mara Redux tutorial done, but you know. Slowbie here.

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What's the command to turn Auto Shot OFF (or not on to begin with)?

For example, I want to cast Arcane Shot rank 1 and NOT have it followed up by Auto Shot. I've done a ton of searching and the only thing that semi-works is:

/cast Arcane Shot(rank 1)

/script ClearTarget()

But I'd rather not lose the target (adding /script TargetLastTarget() basically undoes the ClearTarget and makes Auto Shot shoot, I assume because of the delay). There has to be another way to keep Auto Shot from firing. 

Edit: In your "General Shots" section you list macros for initiating Auto Shot alongside other shots, which I don't understand because, with the exception of Scatter Shot, using any other shot automatically initiates Auto Shot. What am I missing?

Edited by Jellydonut
Clarification

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13 hours ago, Jellydonut said:

What's the command to turn Auto Shot OFF (or not on to begin with)?

/script SpellStopCasting() works, so you could put that in with the spell and it would act as a kind of toggle. You'll need to put the stopcast line before the spell line i think. Alternatively you could use 

/cast Arcane Shot(rank 1)
/script ClearTarget()  end;
/script TargetLastTarget()

The end isn't valid (so it's going to give error), but it'll make the macro functional. Can't think how to do it correctly at the mo. You'll need to press the key a second time to reacquire target.

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Tried the the stop casting script and it doesn't work, at least not in this context. If placed before the shot command, then the shot goes off as normal and initiates auto shot. If placed after the shot command, then it interrupts the whole thing and nothing is fired (get "interrupted" message). 

As to the second part, appreciate the suggestion but I'd rather just go with ClearTarget under those circumstances. 

Edit: /script SpellStopCasting() stops ALL spells and shots from being cast. What I basically need is the script that would stop ONLY Auto Shot. I've tried /script SpellStopCasting("Auto Shot") but that doesn't seem to work. 

Further edit: I understand what you mean now by "toggle" with the stop casting script, but I'm looking for a one-press solution. I have Auto Shot separately bound, so I can always stop it with another key press and not need a macro. 

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17 hours ago, Jellydonut said:

What's the command to turn Auto Shot OFF (or not on to begin with)?

For example, I want to cast Arcane Shot rank 1 and NOT have it followed up by Auto Shot. I've done a ton of searching and the only thing that semi-works is:

/cast Arcane Shot(rank 1)

/script ClearTarget()

But I'd rather not lose the target (adding /script TargetLastTarget() basically undoes the ClearTarget and makes Auto Shot shoot, I assume because of the delay). There has to be another way to keep Auto Shot from firing. 

Edit: In your "General Shots" section you list macros for initiating Auto Shot alongside other shots, which I don't understand because, with the exception of Scatter Shot, using any other shot automatically initiates Auto Shot. What am I missing?

Hi there ^^

In answer to your question about why Auto Shot has an enable script alongside other shots, such as Arcane Shot, this is because hitting the keybind for that ability will NOT turn on Auto Shot if the ability is on cooldown. It's a failsafe to ensure Auto Shot is enabled if you try to perform one shot, but forget that it's on CD.

Not that someone should be using any ability other than Auto Shot at first under most circumstances.

As for how to stop Auto Shot, there is no one-press solution, it seems. Thanks to @Moiz' suggestion for SpellStopCast, I checked it in-game, but unfortunately it didn't work when I put it after Arcane Shot. It simply stopped Arcane Shot's cast altogether. However, this here macro:

Quote

/script if GetUnitName("target")==nil then TargetNearestEnemy() end
/script SpellStopCasting()
/cast Arcane Shot(rank 1)

Worked after two presses. The first press skipped over SpellStopCasting because nothing was being cast. Arcane Shot was fired, and Auto Shot was attempted. A second press stopped Auto Shot, and repeated presses continued to prevent anything until Arcane Shot was off cooldown. This is referred to as a "fall-through" macro. And I can see you've already tried it yourself, but I'm just confirming as a second tester.

Being able to toggle it off with another press doesn't negate the appeal of this macro, though! You can fit it on one button for a more rapid toggle-off, and this especially comes in handy if you make use of certain scripts intended to prevent Auto Shot from ever turning off under any other conditions. Like I do!

Perhaps some more context would be helpful. What would be the purpose of trying to toggle off Auto Shot, if you don't mind me asking? ^^
 

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