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1 minute ago, NoGnomo said:

fucking casuals im gonna puke

 

let only the r14 speaks pls

 

go get ur r10s meanwhile u plebs

Casuals? Your calling people who play the game 40+ hours a week casual? 

Lol dude, you need to take a step back and realize that your little club of 50 people is ruining the game for the 10's of thousands of us who play. its not because you are better players, its not because your more skilled (some of you are, and most of you are more skilled than the vast majority of players) its because you have the time and the inclination to create a mafia to control PvP.

Your not R14 because your the best PvP'er on the server, your R14 because you had 60+ hours a week for 4 months to sit in an empty BG farming honor. 

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19 minutes ago, reagan said:

There was never meant to be a delineation between PvP and PvE in vanilla wow. You raided to get gear to go into battlegrounds and stomp face. The reason why people drooled over T2 was because it was amazing compared to anything else available. The reason why people feared T2.5 and the small amount of T3 u saw was because you knew those players would deal huge damage. You were part of a single community some of the time you PvE’ed sometimes PvP – this artificial separation into people who PvP 60 hours a week and those who PvE is what’s causing players to burn out/get bored and quit.

Enjoy about the current PvP scene? Honestly, nothing. It’s a grind that does not include actually playing the game. Its 100% about grinding out ridiculous amounts of honor and controlling BRM1 in often what skirts standover/extortion and degenerates into win trading/account sharing and insane expectations on the number of hours to obtain R14. A very high % of people either never achieve the rank they desired, or quit the game once they do.

Whats wrong with PvP? In a nut shell, nobody has any fun while doing battlegrounds. You simply can’t queue up and actually PvP, its either be in a premade and stomp empty BG’s or solo queue into a bg where you get stomped and everyone else afk’s.  Blizzard introduced battlegrounds not as a way to obtain gear, but as a second pillar to end game activity.  Towards the end of Vanilla, around the time of the first blizcon, blizzard themselves realized rank’s were a bad idea, it was creating very negative behavior (similar but to a far less extreme than we see) and did away with them. That was when most of the serious rankers earned 300K honor a week – were dealing with 3-5 Million. What we see on our servers is not blizz like, it never was – the moment players even started acting 1/5 as bad as what we see blizzard blew up the ranking system and started again.

Fundamentally the issue is around the competition for rank, the number of people who want to obtain R14 far exceeds the number who can. It creates an insane level of competition that goes far beyond anything blizzard saw, or had in mind when they created the system. The number of hours required to hit R14, and the behavior you need to engage in to do it is neither healthy for the player nor for the server in general.

What would I like to see? Some way for the vast majority of the player population to be able to queue for a BG and actually get to participate in PvP. Pug vs Pug only battle grounds. Make it easier for people to get R14 – not “easy”, Easier. It shouldn’t take someone being part of a syndicate that exerts control over the entire PvP scene to reach their goals. It shouldn’t take 13+ weeks of pvping 60 hours a week to earn R14.

1) Remove the ability to Group Queue

2) Remove the ability to see other players honor (or even potentially your own)

3) Make it easier to achieve R14 - bigger Brackets, less honor required for each rank. (see 4 though for preferred solution)

4) Blow up ranks - move to the late vanilla system of purchase items through honor/battle ground marks - still vanilla like for the haters, this is how blizz fixed this issue.

5) Remove the R12+ gear entirely. PvP was never supposed to be the way to earn best in slot gear, pvp gear was an afterthought until TBC. (gonna get flamed hard i know - but im throwing out anything i can think of that might encourage people to actually pvp, not rank, actually fight and enjoy the game)

 

TL:DR – if we do not provide a way for the 99% of the population who want to actually PvP to PvP they will quit and the server will wither away and die. People don’t want to raid log, they want to play the character they have spent time gearing out – but currently there is no possible way to pvp and enjoy it.

Do not under and circumstances upgrade the PvP gear earlier – it will simply make the problem worse.

Do enact the fix to rank gear that was posted on Github this week (You need the rank to buy the gear) this is how it was in Vanilla, this is how it should be here.

1) remove the only fun in the game that is premade vs premade

2) lol

3) lolol

4) lololooooollolo

5)lololooooooollololoo

you are playing a vanilal server, go wotlk or something casual omg


OR BETTER JUST LISTEN TO THIS GUY AND MAKE A FUNSERVER WHO CARES ANYMORE

/crYyyyyyyyyyyyYyyyyyyyyyyYyyyyyyyyyyyYyyyyYyy


PS: add paladins to horde

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Just now, reagan said:

Casuals? Your calling people who play the game 40+ hours a week casual? 

Lol dude, you need to take a step back and realize that your little club of 50 people is ruining the game for the 10's of thousands of us who play. its not because you are better players, its not because your more skilled (some of you are, and most of you are more skilled than the vast majority of players) its because you have the time and the inclination to create a mafia to control PvP.

Your not R14 because your the best PvP'er on the server, your R14 because you had 60+ hours a week for 4 months to sit in an empty BG farming honor. 

have u read the definition of CASUAL?

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Cater to casuals and PVE folks, which are the vast majority. Or cater to premades and twinks. Management needs to make the decision. You can't please everyone, but PVP right now is a disaster except for no-lifers with r14.

Group queues have to go. In addition, the queue should be randomized every 30 seconds so it doesn't matter if the premade clicks at the same time. After 10 minutes of waiting, the folks still waiting are no longer affected by the randomization.

The wintrading would be a lot harder if you can't predict when the wintraders on the other end will hit the BG.

You want premades? There is a whole world for PVP. You can do premade vs. premade too or raid a capital city.  Premades belong in world PVP, not BGs.

Account wide death penalty for the chronic (not occasional) AFK watching Netflix, bots, wintrading, and essentially shared 24x7 accounts. 

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If you whant Fix PvP just do two things

1-Bring back MULTIQUEUE

2-Do cross realms BG on all brackets

I miss Anathena 39 pvp like hell,server is dead and cold full of pve antysocial nerds,i start on Ely and i hope low lv bgs is not dead here too.

Regards

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more anathema pop tnx bg's are already good here since AQ came out ranking gear is not that needed and people pvp for fun !

 

Oh and multi que would be nice but do it like they did it on Kronos, you can multique but after you accept a que and you enter a battleground the other que is gone dodging can still happen but that's why you got the ban hammer

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Some of the posts here are so retarded.

 

"Pls stop wintrading and premades" but on the other hand "enable multiqueue again"

 

Yea. Ok.

You haven't thought a single second about this then.

 

If you want wintrading and premades to stop, or make it harder, you disable multiqueue.

Yet it happens, we all know theres no big way to prevent it all the time.

 

But this only gets way worse with Multiqueue.

Multiqueue was a mistake on Nostalrius and it would be a mistake here.

 

Both BG's pop at the same time > Great, you have either completly empty games or a 15v5 in AB.

Great idea.

 

Stop thinking like morons that want r14 given out for basically no work at all except queueing, accepting, winning without a fight.

Shitters.

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Feedback : Stop denying Evidence based on self experience and don't act like Darkrasp from Crestfall.

/Kind regards Killerduki

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 Multiqueue is blizlike so it should be here and is dosent matter you like it or not,bg is not only lv 60,a lot of guys play on low levels.I remember when they disabled it on Nost,pvp pop drop down on all brackets noticeably,49 be completly dead after that.

  Anathena bg on low lv dosent exist anymore,for me and a lot of ppls it was main reson to play here again,cross realms bg will be great idea if this is possible ofc.

Regards

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PvP on Darrowshire is going fine. All you PvP server players seem so salty lol. Seems I made the right choice.

Altho our pool is ridiculously small so even rank 11 was some push for me!

Elysium staff, if you make a drastic non blizzlike change, you will successfully kill the only reason people PvP here: it being blizzlike and hard. If you make it easy people will quit because that's what retail is for. Not that it requires skill, but it's tough!

 

Also all servers except Elysium are dying. Darrowshire goes down 100players avg every week, most people I knoe just raid log, zethkur is dead and anathema heaving its sinking breaths. Don't know how you can help that tbh, the hype died and you guys couldn't keep up. There's too much drama, corruption and similar.  And there's too many servers. Is 4 rly necessary? A PvE and PvP seemed enough. Opening Elysium was fresh, yes, but it has heavily split the playerbase. Ah well. Whatever you get out of this feedback session, be extremely careful. One wrong unblizzlike box ticked and half your playerbase vanishes.

Flex

Noiryx

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Nothing is wrong with PvP management-wise. The problem is in people that participate. And the solution is in them as well.

If they don't want to PvP, they won't. If they want the gear, they will. If they are not happy with premades, but do not care enough to create their own group in a mmo game, then who should care for them?

Instead of listening to one party, then listening to another, and then endlessly working out a compromise, that will leave nobody happy, just keep the status quo.

Keep it blizzlike. Marks expiration, item stats, availability... Whatever. Blizzlike is something everyone hopefully can agree upon by now.

Fix bugs, ban afkers, gold sellers, win-traders. Do the maintenance stuff. Leave the player's problems to them - to solve or to whine about.

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10 minutes ago, Motorbreath said:

Nothing is wrong with PvP management-wise.

You actually meant nothing is wrong with PVE right and that is a typo?

PVP is really broken on Elysium unless you're truly blind. You're totally oblivious to it.

Think logically. We wouldn't be having this thread if it was sunshine and roses in PVP like you suggest and leave everything blizzlike. PVP is very broken and many players are disgusted with the current situation while the PVE side is doing pretty well. 

Many of us returned many years later with jobs and families. I cannot PVP 40+ hours a week farming honor by sitting in the graveyard of a BG and killing lowbies in WPVP. Neither is fun so we don't PVP.

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<NOTHING PERSONAL> Led this Raid! Thank you all for coming! God we look good boys!!!!!!

~Guild master of <NOTHING PERSONAL>

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Focus a little bit more on PVP-related bugs would be nice :) Like Ice Reflector and the blink/charge, not sure if these are on the bug tracker or not!

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What's something that you enjoy about our current PvP scene?

 

I like how the current scene isn't totally saturated with gear yet.  Everyone feels squishy and there are people with terrible gear (like myself) PvPing.  I joined this project because World PVP was so awesome in Vanilla.  AV will be great when we merge and update to 1.5

 

Something that you dislike?

 

I don't like fighting constant pre-mades as a PUG.  I don't like how easy it potentially is to account share/exploit and get high ranks. Edit: Ensure that all PVP bugs are handled too please

 

What's missing?

 

I would like to see come checks & balances when it comes to Rank 14.  R14 should be earned while respecting the TOS.  Lots of people will be account sharing, colluding with the opposing faction, cheating, kill trading, etc.  This is basically the strongest gear in the game and the Elysium team should have a way of monitoring it

 

What would you like to see improved?

 

This thread has a lot of complaints about the Zeth'kur merge (which should have happened in February).  I wish some more clarity and information about the merge was given to these folks on the journey to high ranks awhile back.  I would also like to see transparency about the PVP cheating/violating TOS process.  Being able to join a battleground anywhere in the world might be cool if you are under level 30 maybe, so 1-29 can que from anywhere in the world.

 

Any other thoughts / comments / suggestions?

Thanks for taking the time to collect community feedback.  Every player is important on Elysium because without our large population, the project wouldn't be fun!  I'm looking forward to transferring to Elysium, if there is anything that the playerbase can do, please let us know

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I got an idea that will boost PVP and World PVP....NO DISHONORABLE KILLS!!!I I have 38 DKs and it makes me not even want to rank up anymore....Most PVP players are afraid to raid Cities.

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My suggestions;

1. Disallow raid group queuing, limit it to party queues. This will encourage involvement and be more entertaining for all involved. Most premades are dull to be apart of as you just stomp the opposition and then afk, and those players on the opposite side are mostly afk from the beginning. People also always bring up the "Why don't you make your own premade", well we have numerous times, but Alliance controls the queue and I find if we create a premade in WSG for instance and beat the Alliance prem, they just stop queuing and go to AB and the cycle continues. They don't want competition. They want free honor. I've even had two different Alliance AB prems just let us win because we weren't worth their time which proves this point.

Mind you, it's also much more irritating to form a premade on horde side because the queues are so long, often people don't want to give up their queue to be apart of the premade. (which is made worse by Alliance switching as soon as they lose, making queue intolerably long)

I am of course speaking of Elysium.

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Though I'm not a very well spoken person, I have a considerable time investment ranking on darrowshire and would like to highlight some issues regarding PvP.

for context and perspective, I speak as a rank 12 mage on darrowshire alliance that has a time investment greater than many rank 14 players, and a lower rank warrior also on darrowshire alliance.

What's something that you enjoy about our current PvP scene?

Currently on darrowshire not much, PvP suffers from many issues that make PvP simply not fun which added in my decision to quit ranking earlier.

PvP can still be fun and what I find to be the most enjoyable is working together towards BG objectives, interaction between both your own players as well the oppossing players by accounting for them in your strategies.

 

Something that you dislike?

oh boy where do I start, I think I'll have to go with the time investment that happens when the system becomes extremely competitive for very few spots, on darrowshire with mostly 1 BG running at a time ranking has become a question of who can log more hours which is a very unhealthy system both design wise as for the players health themselves, this was probably the most heavy weight for me to quit ranking short of my goal.

reaching a breaking point where it becomes wiser not to play because you'll lose more hours on illness is very very far from a fun experience.

next up has got to be cheating, various chinese players over the course of darrowshires lifespan have account shared their way to standing 1 destroying any competition as they walk unpunished with the exception of 1, still these players did massive damage to an already fragile system.

account sharing is hard to prove which makes it hard to enforce, sadly I don't see many opportunities here but advancements in data collection to provide evidence against account sharers.

another big point is gameplay itself, which can be divided in two major divisions, Player based issues and Server based issues.

amongst players theres a clear distinction between the rankers and those that pvp casually, often do these groups of players not get along because of the massive difference in goals.

in a system where hours spent equals more rank progression anyone pushing ranks is mostly interested and concerned with exactly that, pushing in as many hours, this in turn means these players want to input minimal energy in games so they can go on longer per day and thus be more capable in competing for rank.

combine this with the fact that horde is running an organized premade that is unstopable with alliance FFA chaos and you have the ranking playerssemi afk unable to do anything to turn the game around and the casual PvPers massively iritated by this behaviour, which lead to complaints against the ranking players which are pretty much powerless to do anything against the premade and in turn get iritated by the behaviour of casual PvPers.

moving on to server based issues, theres various issues regarding the way the server handles information, and the functioning/bugs regarding some spells that make pvp an uninteractive and unfun experience.

I've PvP'd on both a mage and a warrior on this server, and with both classes I run into the same issue, namely being unable to attack my opponents while they have no issues attacking me.

on my mage I can have a melee right on top of me, cast frost nova and have absolutely nothing happen, or simply get killed from 20yd far away melee attacks.

on my warrior I run into a somewhat similair issue, and that is I find myself unable to attack ranged targets, I can be moving right on top of them and auto attacks don't go off, and find myself often getting charged first in warrior mirrors.

one could say this is an issue with lagg on my end, however I have a very capable connection that is consistantly under 30ms, and one of the fastest networks available in a first world country.

the only place I can see where this issue spawns from is that the server takes in information on time, but sends it out to slowly, causing the slower connecting players sent information to overrule that of players with better connections.

If this gues is correct, I find it very concerning that a system promotes poor connections as an advantage, one only has to look at lagg macro's to understand how silly this is.

 

What's missing?

enjoyability of PvP, improving information handling and solving spell related issues are massive steps towards improving this.

I strongly believe that interaction makes for the most fun in this game, but currently interaction is difficult due to small player pools, strong differences in ideals and the functionality of the game itself.

 

What would you like to see improved?

from a casual perspective I'd like to see PvP more fun, and to me that means solving the above mentioned issues of interaction.

from a ranking perspective, a drastic but much needed one in my opinion is changing the ranking system, there's various things in classic WoW that make it was it is, but I can't really say this for the PvP system, the only thing that really stands out about this system is that you can brag that you wasted insanely many hours and deteriorated your own body, which doesn't sound exactly all that great to be the major selling point, and it is very clear exactly why blizzard got rid of this system with no clear upsides to keeping it around.

ofcourse diagnosing problems is much easier than solving them, and while I can't think of a perfect solution, I would still like to contribute with some possibilities.

1. reshape the ranking system to be HK based instead of RP based.

pros:

ranking players will actively play amongst casual players to obtain the HK's they need for rank progression, whilst casual players again can enjoy having ranking players play besides them rather than making it feel as if they were against them.

cons:

battleground objectives take a backseat and are only important to those who want to push battleground reputation rewards.

neutral: 

with no decay possible in honor kills this system has a defined ending point and is not so much about consecutive play but rather total play, if this is better or worse is debatable.

comment:

having played on a server that has used a similair system before I can say that I am familiar with the consequences of such a system, and find them to be an improvement over the current ranking system.

as for number, I'm not sure about other servers but as for darrowshire the current results of the playerbase according to realmplayers follows a formula that is very close to 1honor kill per 1.71rank points or 1rank point per 0.58honor kills

such a system would make ranking no harder or easier but extremely consistent in effort to reward ratio.

2. change decay in the current system.

anyone that has played darrowshires top standings for the top ranks knows how much of an influence decay is, with the fierce competition having saturated ranks per standing and locked progression down almost entirely to require a high standing to make any progression at all, decay has formed a serious hurdle in the rank progression of many, where all they can do is play insane hours week on week making no progress at all to simply wait for the player spending more hours than them to finish, this becomes even more of a problem when lower rank players dump more hours to grind progression to a complete standstill over entire brackets.

the issues in this system lie in defining the numbers for it.

pros:

ranking becomes more consistent and higher ranks more available

cons:

higher ranks might become to easily obtainable if numbers are not carefully determined.

neutral: 

with  more RP flowing into than out of the system overal ranking becomes easier universally amongst ranks, if this is considered desireable is up for debate.

comment:

a system like this could be somewhat difficult to implement correctly, and with no experience in such a system I am uncertain if it can accomplish desireable traits of a ranking system that is fair, fun and still prestigeous.

 

3. change bracket cutoff points in the current system

this is a more simplistic change with easy to oversee consequences, changing bracket numbers solves issues like what happend on darrowshire with a complete standstill for high ranks.

pros:

widen the chokepoint that high standings form for high ranks making high ranks move available.

cons:

ranking could become to easy with much more RP flowing into the system than was intended.

players that have gone through the old system are unaccounted for in fairness of the system.

neutral:

with much more RP flowing into the system overal ranking becomes easier universally amongst ranks, if this is considered desireable is up for debate.

comment:

while solving current issues, this system points to long term changes that could be undesirable.

while current population can flow on through the system, as players flow through the system high standings could become abundant, as well as overal RP inflow of the system making for a much easier ranking experience in general, this could remove any prestige for old and new players from their ranks, on top of being very biased in favor of newer players and thus unfair to older players.

the long term effects of this system is why I personally don't see it work to well and why I listed it last amongst my suggestions.

 

Any other thoughts / comments / suggestions?

for those that see these changes as unblizzlike, look at the current state of PvP and consider for yourself wether that is blizzlike or not firstly.

as for casualization, I am not in favor of this, however I am in favor of keeping the input/output of effort to rewards to be closer to blizzlike.

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..or offer a second respec option that charges BG marks instead of gold (since they will only have a 24 hour duration now), so people can PvP more freely (or PvP and then go to PvE), without being an awful spec. It shouldn't take 100g to casually queue a couple BGs in the proper spec.

Love this idea! I'd love to see this implemented on all realms.

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The only thing I've noticed so far on Anathema (I'm only 57 as of yesterday) is the complete lack of interest the Alliance has over winning AV, this last weekend.

I started queuing at level 51 on Friday and played til' 2k into Honored reputation... and never won a single game :D

Alliance just running around mid, getting herbs, being AFK (which causes the rest to do the same, cause there is no team play or care). Horde terrain jumping into Alliance backyard base each game, skipping the bridge and winning.

 

I can live it, just slower reputation gain... but it's a rather pointless battleground after exalted. Suppose the only 'solutions' for this part would be to remove the profession nodes (though at the same time here - herbs especially are in high demand and arguably needed) or make the wall jump impossible.

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Alright, so let me point out a few flaws right off the bat. What rly messed up the entire community was when Nostalrius suddenly chickened out and asked for all their contents to be deleted. I would have never honored that and would have even tried making all the accounts in the DB available (if at all possible ofc), rather than deleting the unactivated accounts. Futhermore Elysium screwed up badly by splitting up the community across two and eventually three servers. If you hadn't done it this way, there would probably not be a problem with the active communities in both PvE- and the PvP-scene today, and even throughout the summer! Combine all this with the fact that we're trying to stay Blizzlike with all the design flaws and joys it involves, and it's pretty clear you should not try to go even more custom than you've already done. I could possibly support up to two respecs per week costing some kind of PvP-currency or at least less than 50g each, but as we all know this would also be exploited by PvE guilds. Not that I really think this is a bad thing though: The community is stuggling more and more every week to run proper raids, so this could very much save the community too. Adding duals spec is pretty much out of the question, and also probably not at all possible due to the fact that the client would also have to be patched.

Premades are Blizzlike, so I'm really sceptical if we should try to rid ourselves of these. Then again it's extremely demotivational to meet a premade when in a normal pug BG. Maybe force any premade to queue as just that: a premade, and not allowing more than 5 to queue in a BG. Then again this could take the joy out of queueing as a larger group of friends, so this needs to be handled extremely delicately.

If there's anything other you wanna consider, it's really simple: remove farming mats from any BG or greatly increase their respawn time. This will get rid of a lot of gold-farming too.

I've been to many cancerous AVs this weekend and can tell there are so many that simply does not understand how it's won. I don't believe in punishment. I'm entering dangerous territory here, but maybe consider adding a substancial bonus for a quickly completed BG? This can probably only be added in combination with a system that forces premades to queue against other premades. Sadly the exploiting potential is big too, so thread carefully!

If you must add any kind of punishment then please add votekick to both 5-mans and BGs. I wished for this so many times back at Nost.

Just at the very end of this lost post, please take into consideration that the problem lies in the poor design and harsh tuning of the PvP-system by Blizzard. We're playing Vanilla maybe just because it is flawed as this often makes for a much more credible experience than those that are overly polished. Nostlarius was really onto something by running a 15k limit, because even if the draw distance and lag was pretty bad, we always had the possibility to have fun and challenges every single of those 24 hours in each day. Only weekends were slow at night, and that was about it.

PS. For the love of god DO NOT start adjusting stats on the items!

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What's something that you enjoy about our current PvP scene?

Nothing  Elysium realm 

Something that you dislike?

I dislike that 80% of the alliance only pvp for a few hours a day (4-5 premades running at peak hours) ye same those alliance would just say make a horde premade urself but its not the same just by doing this ur killing the pvp for the whole horde faction they struggle with 30-50 min ques all day. Yes we all want gear clearly alliance puts the effort and time to be more organized but the whole server is struggling because of that i am sure if u drop the premades and even start queing as 3-5  friends  u will have more fun it won't all just be about brackets and gear. Don't u wanna get recognized as being a good player instead of as being a good premade ? 

As for horde what i dislike is the majority of afk/semi-afk players in bg's 

What's missing?

Faction balance / Active pvpers / Multi que only for non premades  (u are forcing the whole server to play only AB no need for 2 battlegrounds if 1 faction decides they will just play wsg on its weekend)

What would you like to see improved?

Talent cost decaying system maybe each week u decay 50% of ur current cost the cap should still be 50 gold 

Any other thoughts / comments / suggestions?

 

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7 hours ago, fivealts said:

You actually meant nothing is wrong with PVE right and that is a typo?

PVP is really broken on Elysium unless you're truly blind. You're totally oblivious to it.

Think logically. We wouldn't be having this thread if it was sunshine and roses in PVP like you suggest and leave everything blizzlike. PVP is very broken and many players are disgusted with the current situation while the PVE side is doing pretty well. 

Many of us returned many years later with jobs and families. I cannot PVP 40+ hours a week farming honor by sitting in the graveyard of a BG and killing lowbies in WPVP. Neither is fun so we don't PVP.

If you can't do it then why do you believe that you are entitled to the rewards? There is nothing preventing you from heading out in the world to do some world PvP, raid a city or gather your guildies up and play a few bg's for fun.

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